Please excuse the grammatical errors, any other errors you come across, and the general sloppiness of this transcription of Much Abu About Nothing's podcast episode on Alice in Wonderland! Our episodes are transcribed by a robot and roughly edited by Misha (which takes a long time).
Tyler 00:00
content warning. Although this is a podcast about kids movies, this podcast isn't for kids and may contain content some people find offensive
Misha 00:21
Welcome to Much Abu About Nothing, a podcast where we discuss and rate animated Disney films going in alphabetical order following a rigorous and scientific scoring system based on absolutely nothing. I am one of your hosts Misha,
Tyler 00:38
and I'm your other host Tyler. And this week we are talking about 1951's Alice in Wonderland not the one with Johnny Depp. The one with- is that even Disney? The new one is that Disney
Misha 00:51
Yeah. I mean it's on Disney+ so, um, you know if we ever get around to like, instead of just the animated films where- we only do live action, you know?
Tyler 01:02
Alright, so if we ever if... we ever finish this journey, I think before we go to that we should... I mean, I guess it's up to the fans. Like if the fans say like, do this movie maybe we have to make a decision but my personal preference would be like doing the direct to video movies.
Misha 01:22
Oh, okay. Yeah,
Tyler 01:24
because there's a lot of hot garbage in that like Aladdin 2 we talked about Aladdin 3.
Misha 01:29
Tinker Bell and like whatever she's up to on her sassy molassy adventures.
Tyler 01:36
Yeah. And then after that, or maybe before, what about I know this isn't Disney but
Misha 01:42
Bob.
Tyler 01:42
...it's Disney adjacent. Bob?
Misha 01:45
You said what about...
Tyler 01:47
oh, har har har. I was gonna say like Don Bluth films because it's Disney adjacent. he worked for Disney. They he left and that caused the quote unquote...
Misha 01:58
Who's Don Bluth?
Tyler 01:59
Don Bluth did like "All Dogs Go to Heaven", "Anastasia", "Land Before Time".
Misha 02:04
Oh, those are all so good.
Tyler 02:06
There as much of my childhood as-
Misha 02:08
But it's one person?
Tyler 02:08
It's Don Bluth productions like he left with a bunch of....
Misha 02:12
Oh, oh.
Tyler 02:12
The reason Disney went into like the quote unquote, Dark Ages in the 80s is because he and a bunch of the talent left and started their own studio. And then like,
Misha 02:22
oh,
Tyler 02:22
and those movies are. I mean, some of them are not great, but they're like, as much of my childhood as Disney movies are.
Misha 02:28
Yeah, I agree.
Tyler 02:30
But we got to stick to our process for now and then we'll see what happens in the future. But
Misha 02:35
yeah,
Tyler 02:35
as long as we like. We should stave off the live like,
Misha 02:40
Oh, good. Yes, thank you.
Tyler 02:42
Maleficient and Maleficent 2s.
Misha 02:45
No terrible. Yeah, you're right.
Tyler 02:46
Which I watched.
Misha 02:47
I would rather not have to watch those. You did? I
Tyler 02:49
I watched them, yeah.
Misha 02:50
I never watched them.
Tyler 02:51
Don't do it. You especially would not like... I think we talked about this actually.
Misha 02:55
So before we get into Alice in Wonderland, here are my updates. So after, after we watched Aladdin, I called my sister to ask, you know, because I had some very personal biases about Aladdin, trying to... feeling like it wasn't as super racist as other people might think. Because it meant something to me as a child to finally see some brown people from like my very general region of the world portrayed in children's movies and it was the first time we'd ever seen it. So I asked my sister if she felt it was super racist, or if she appreciated it and she was on the same page as me at... especially at the time wasn't offended, just really happy to see you know, some brown people in a cartoon and like she actually said, "you know, by the time we were old enough, it- or by the time that movie came out the damage like the racism damage had already been done not having anybody to you know, look at in cartoons or even really, TV or anything that look like us" so she also really loves it for that reason. So it was nice to have some sort of...
Tyler 04:09
Yeah, because it Yeah, because
Misha 04:11
backup.
Tyler 04:11
Before it was just you versus versus a white old me.
Misha 04:16
Yeah. One last thing I want to say about Aladdin before we move on to Alice in Wonderland. So it came- it was brought to my attention that there is a line in the Prince Ali song that goes- that the genie sings when he's introducing Prince Ali, that goes "He's got slaves. He's got servants and flunkies," and I totally missed that in... while watching it because... I like the song and it just washed over me and that's pretty fucked up. So...
Tyler 04:54
yeah, until you mentioned it I don't know if I ever noticed that and then like the next line is like "they love to work for him" or something. What is it? How did it go?
Misha 05:01
Yeah, um... "proud to work for him"
Tyler 05:03
"proud to work for him." Yeah,
Misha 05:04
"proud to work for him." And it's like, no, no,
Tyler 05:06
it's weird too because they changed the Arabian Nights song like for...
Misha 05:13
to be less offensive, right.
Tyler 05:14
Yeah, the original was "they cut off your ear if they don't like your face. It's barbaric. But hey, it's home", they changed that for the home video release. But yeah,
Misha 05:24
right, but slaves are fine. Okay.
Tyler 05:26
That's really odd. It's not even- the fucking genie's a slave. Give me a fuck- Come on, Genie.
Misha 05:31
Yeah! His whole thing is that he wants to be freed and now he's like, "Oh, Aladdin. So great. Anyway for having slaves." So um... we all know...
Tyler 05:41
They did change it for the Will Smith one.
Misha 05:43
Yeah, god. Oh my god. At least they did that. But Jesus Christ.
Tyler 05:47
yeah.
Misha 05:47
Okay, so I think we should go back and change the doesn't sit- take away more points from the "doesn't sit right" because that's really fucked, and
Tyler 05:59
I am totally fine with that.
Misha 06:01
I know you're fine with that.
Tyler 06:02
I'm fine with that. I was pushing for a negative five to "doesn't sit right" so I'm fine with giving a couple more points in this category.
Misha 06:09
Let's take off two, two more points. So negative four.
Tyler 06:12
Negative four? Okay.
Misha 06:13
Yeah.
Tyler 06:14
All right. So quick, just a quick aside to the teens if I can, the teens corner with Tyler.
Misha 06:19
Oh boy.
Tyler 06:20
I TOLD YOU SO teens, I told you so. Okay, I'm back.
Misha 06:22
Okay, so that drops down Aladdin to 62 points. So it is no longer tied for first place with a Goofy movie, putting a Goofy Movie putting a Goofy Movie back at the top, Aladdin...
Tyler 06:38
Where it should be.
Misha 06:39
Disney. Disney that is fucked up. Okay. It's not cool to have enslaved people like, yeah, do better.
Tyler 06:47
Yeah. And for anybody out there. Like, first of all, you know, if we don't say this enough, thank you so much for listening. But also, like, you know, I've gotten a couple of comments like, "Was it that bad? I haven't seen it in a while." And, you know, maybe some people don't get offended, but like, we do need to call shit like this out, I think.
Misha 07:03
Yeah, yeah,
Tyler 07:03
we're not we're not always gonna get it. Right. So thanks for the update.
Misha 07:07
Yeah, so, um, I watched Alice in Wonderland twice. The first time. Yep. The first time I did edibles, which is great. And I'll talk a little bit about you know, when we get into it, like how amazing... okay, I highly recommend doing that. It was the most incredible movie I've ever watched it was perfect in every way. The first time around, but then after it ended, because it's a pretty short movie.
Tyler 07:37
Yeah.
Misha 07:38
Steve said that we should put on the live version, the live action version of Aladdin.
Tyler 07:47
Okay.
Misha 07:48
Okay, being that high, and putting that on was a huge mistake. I mean, it's a huge mistake anyway. I'm guessing.
Tyler 07:54
I did tell you to watch it though. Just so we could dunk on it. But yeah,
Misha 07:58
I lasted maybe three minutes. I was screaming at it the whole time. It's.... I know it's probably not any more racist than the cartoon, but it sure feels way more racist than the cartoon. And it was just horrible. Will Smith can't sing. I think that was him singing or they had somebody who can't sing dubbing for him. Oh,
Tyler 08:22
What are you talking about? What about like Wild Wild West? I guess that's rapping but...
Misha 08:25
It's rapping Yeah, it's like melodic rapping he can't sing. Oh, my God.
Tyler 08:38
Yeah, it's bad. They at least got brown people. But it's it's a bad movie.
Misha 08:43
Yeah.
Tyler 08:44
It's Guy Ritchie too which is..
Misha 08:46
I noticed. I saw and I don't understand. That's for a different podcast.
Tyler 08:51
That's for the Yeah, this that's her Much Abu About Nothing after hours, or office hours, it's called office hours.
Misha 08:57
Ew.
Tyler 08:59
After hours. Sounds bad.
Misha 09:01
It sounds really bad. That's Tyler's separate podcast. I'm not on that one.
Tyler 09:05
Listen. Let's pivot to the topic for today's episode.
Misha 09:11
Sorry, that took so long, everybody.
Tyler 09:13
No, it's all right. Oh, sorry. Actually, no, before we do you, you watched it first on edibles, the second time you watched it normal.
Misha 09:20
The second time I watched it I realized, we'll get into it when we get to the scoring, still enjoyable, still very enjoyable, not as profound and mind blowing as the first time. Still fun. So should we just quickly go through what categories we're going to be rating in our ranking system?
Tyler 09:43
Yeah, sure. So for those who maybe haven't listened to earlier episodes, we rank these films based on several categories originality, story, animation, music and sound, the protagonist and side kick if there is one, villain if there is one and henchmen, strong female lead is another category, bipoc representation is another category. And final category is fun factor. And then after that we've got a couple of sort of things that can either give it some negative points, aka, what we call "doesn't sit right". And maybe some little positive points for effervescence, sort of Durkheimian Disney magic, and then we get a total score and so far nothing's got a C yet. Everything's below. Below 70. But we'll see. We'll see where things go. Do you want to do you want to risk or dare your your classic by this point - Because we've done a few episodes your classic summary at the at the start, you want to summarize this movie?
Misha 10:46
Sure. Okay, this is pretty easy, which we'll get into when we talk about the story points. So Alice falls asleep. We don't know that at the beginning, but...
Tyler 10:57
Spoilers. Everybody's spoilers ahead. Spoilers. Yeah.
Misha 11:01
The story is, falls asleep, has a wacky dream, and wakes up. Boom.
Tyler 11:05
That was the best summary of this movie. I was... When I when I brought this up. I was worried you were gonna do like a beat for beat thing.
Misha 11:14
Like I did with Aladdin.
Tyler 11:15
Yep. So it's good that you didn't do that. Because we'll get into it. We will get into it.
Misha 11:21
Well because I realized like so while the first time I watched it, I was like, oh my god, this is incredible. And then I just realized the second time she just falls asleep. And then the dream is basically just little vignettes, right, like different scenes. And that's it, like nothing really happens. She sees herself, you know, sleeping. She's like, "wake up, wake up." And...
Tyler 11:43
yeah, and we can kinda get into the...
Misha 11:46
yeah,
Tyler 11:46
well, what are you gonna say? You don't know she even...
Misha 11:48
I don't even know if she really learns a lesson.
Tyler 11:52
No, she doesn't. I mean, in classic sort of Lewis Carroll fashion, it's, it's just a bunch of nonsense. I don't really think there's a lesson to be learned. Except for maybe, like, just let's inject some whimsy into your life. Maybe whimsy.
Misha 12:07
Yeah.
Tyler 12:09
We can get to story really quick. But maybe we should cover, I don't think it's going to take very long the originality score, right. It's not very original.
Misha 12:17
Yeah, it's based on a book.
Tyler 12:20
It was based on a book from the 1860s. I think I want to say and then it was done a lot like looking quickly at Wikipedia. It was done almost as much as a Christmas Carol.
Misha 12:30
Yeah. So I would say a one.
Tyler 12:32
I would say one because we gave Aladdin a two and I think it's less original than that.
Misha 12:37
Yeah.
Tyler 12:38
So...
Misha 12:38
yes.
Tyler 12:39
So yeah, that's easy. Done and dusted.
Misha 12:42
One it is.
Tyler 12:42
And I don't think I've seen many... I think the only other adaptation I've seen of this is... because I haven't seen the Johnny Depp one, is like there was like a BBC.
Misha 12:52
Yes. There was a BBC TV version. There was-
Tyler 12:55
Like Carol Channing.
Misha 12:56
I really liked- but I don't, I don't remember. I only watched it when I was a kid.
Tyler 13:00
Yeah, I remember it had the Jabberwocky and it was really scary. But I don't really remember it...
Misha 13:08
But that's from "Through the Looking Glass" isn't it? They- didn't they combine them?
Tyler 13:11
They- they mixed a bunch of it, but I remember being scared by the Jabberwocky. But yeah, so and there's also a video game based on it too, which was supposed to be good, but I never never played it.
Misha 13:22
Oh, Alice. Yes. That video game is awesome.
Tyler 13:23
Like kind of a creepy horror-
Misha 13:25
Yes, it was a computer game right? like back when we were in high school. It was really good.
Tyler 13:30
Yeah, I should.
Misha 13:31
that was awesome, yeah, a super fun game.
Tyler 13:33
Yeah, yeah, cuz it kind of looked at it from like a horror perspective, right?
Misha 13:37
Yes. Yeah. And really fun, really well made. There was also I think a Care Bears episode.
Tyler 13:46
Oh,
Misha 13:46
or like mini... right. Does that ring a bell to you?
Tyler 13:50
No, I mean, I, I vaguely Yeah, I remember. I remember the Care Bears. I remember loving them Care Bear Stare all the way. But I don't remember like episodes or like plots or anything like that.
Misha 14:05
Oh, yes. I'm looking it up, Care- It's a movie. The Care Bears Adventure in Wonderland - an hour and 20 minutes. Okay, we're gonna just watch that for fun.
Tyler 14:15
Okay, so that movie is longer than this one.
Misha 14:20
I said it was an episode. Yeah, it is. I need to figure out how to watch this. And oh my god it had- Oh, wait, no, that wasn't its budget. It made $6 million.
Tyler 14:32
Not bad.
Misha 14:32
That's a lot for you know, something that we can't remember. And I called a TV episode.
Tyler 14:39
Yeah. So, originality low story.
Misha 14:44
I mean, you heard my-
Tyler 14:47
Yeah, the story is a bit-
Misha 14:48
Two sentences.
Tyler 14:50
The story - there's nothing really happening in the story. It's just a...
Misha 14:53
A dream.
Tyler 14:54
It's just a dream and a bunch of weird episodes. Yeah.
Misha 14:58
Right. It's not like a connected story.
Tyler 15:01
Yeah. Have you ever read the book by the way?
Misha 15:05
Yeah, a long- in high school I did.
Tyler 15:08
Yeah, I read it. And I don't remember any of it except for like,
Misha 15:11
I don't remember it either.
Tyler 15:13
The... And when watching this again, like, after not seeing it for a while, I remembered like, oh, yeah, that poem is like... the twinkle, twinkle, little bat. That song is from the book and stuff like that, but don't remember... And I know that they had a bunch... There's a bunch more in the book, obviously. But yeah, so but I feel like in the book, there wasn't really a story either.
Misha 15:33
No, it was just more random shit, I think.
Tyler 15:36
Yeah.
Misha 15:36
thrown in. And-
Tyler 15:38
I mean, do we? What do we say? I mean-
Misha 15:41
Do we dare give it a one?
Tyler 15:42
Do we dare give this one? I'm just trying to think of like, what's coming? What's up in the future? But I guess we have to, we have to look at everything in its own petri dish. But then also, there's a danger. We do that because then we give a Goofy Movie's music at nine out of 10. So we have to be careful.
Misha 16:02
It is so good!
Tyler 16:04
It is good.
Misha 16:05
Anyway.
Tyler 16:07
What about? Yeah, I guess a one maybe? I mean, there is a she she does, like, travel and meet crazy people. Maybe a two.
Misha 16:16
Okay, wait, okay, maybe we -right. Because now that I'm realizing it, the story... The different vignettes are really fun. And there are really great things that happen. And we have great characters. And like, what if we were to think about it as like the little stories within the big story, right? Because the problem is, if we give it a one, then all of the fun things that happen. And all of the little, the adventures that she goes on are actually really great. Like, I like this movie. And I like
Tyler 16:51
Yeah, and it seems like it would give it a one it seems like yeah, it seems like those things are meaningless if we give it a
Misha 16:57
Now we have to define plot. It's like it. Okay, now we have to define what story
Tyler 17:03
well story is like what happens so I would say that that includes like she gets big, she gets small. She wrecks the white rabbits house she meets the dodo and they have the caucus the caucus dance
Misha 17:14
The tea party is wonderful
Tyler 17:16
Tea Party. The whole appropriate croquet game with the with the Queen of Hearts, all that
Misha 17:21
so let's not rate it by the plot synopsis that I get. Yeah, but like what actually happens, and I think it should be high if that's the case.
Tyler 17:31
I mean, I Yeah, you like Well, I think there's no like particular part. I didn't like it just watching it again. I was, I don't know. I just didn't like it as much as I remember liking it. And I was struck by like, it was both packed with shit. But also like, the pacing was really bad. And it was a bit I don't know, like
Misha 17:53
it felt too short to me.
Tyler 17:55
It was just odd because it felt it was short. But it also was like plodding along. And I was I was checking my the watch like, I mean, not literally don't wear watch, but
Misha 18:06
no, I know what you mean.
Tyler 18:07
Yeah, yeah. Like, I don't know, I found it a bit offended both slow, but also packed with shit. And I enjoyed it. I enjoyed parts of it, but I didn't. Yeah, I didn't.
Misha 18:18
To me it felt so fast, which I think is a problem because well, I feel like they're different vignettes. And the story only moves because of all the extra characters where Alice herself isn't changing or growing or evolving or anything and she's not moving it along. She's just like, Okay, here's a place that I'm at. That's weird. Move on to the next.
Tyler 18:40
Yeah.
Misha 18:40
And she's supposed to be following the White Rabbit. But it doesn't even feel like that is part of the story until she goes well, I have to go find the White Rabbit. And then she leaves.
Tyler 18:51
Yeah. And it's, it's there's no reason for her to be following the White Rabbit either. Like,
Misha 18:55
I think they should have made that more compelling.
Tyler 18:58
Yeah. But then how do you do that with such a nonsense story? That is nonsense. Like through it.
Misha 19:03
And it's a dream. Dreams are fucking weird and don't mean anything.
Tyler 19:07
Yeah, I don't know. It's just weird. I mean, I still enjoyed it, but I just was kind of like, I don't. I don't know. I was kinda like, maybe it's just like, a funk I'm in Perhaps maybe that was bleeding into it. Yeah, I don't think it's a two. I think
Misha 19:23
you're right. I don't think it's a two either. Because if we actually just think about like, all the fun stuff like the stories are good in it.
Tyler 19:32
But does it deserve does it deserve higher than Aladdin? Which got to five for those that maybe didn't listen to the last episode? Five out of 10
Misha 19:42
Aladdin got a five?!
Tyler 19:43
Yeah, we gave it a middle thing because because it's I mean,
Misha 19:48
I feel like I'm blacking out
Tyler 19:50
it's a fun story. But as I said, I think it's a bit meh without.
Misha 19:56
Oh, God. All right, you're right.
Tyler 19:59
I'm Just wondering Yeah,
Misha 20:00
I think it should be higher.
Tyler 20:02
I would give it higher than Aladdin to because
Misha 20:05
I would give it higher than Aladdin.
Tyler 20:07
All right. Okay, what about like a six? I mean, here's the thing we gave a Christmas carol was six because of the story not because of the because of that because the we were grading it on like the story of like, like, you know the actual story of Christmas Carol which like at least at the time we agreed was a good story and I would give Alice in Wonderland a five. Okay, I'm fine with that. Because I think like the story of a Christmas carol is is more interesting than the story about Alice in Wonderland.
Misha 20:41
Yes, I agree. Sounds good. Should we go back down to a four? But no, let's keep it at a five. Let's keep it at a five.
Tyler 20:48
I think fives. Okay, because it is fun like the Cheshire cats. Fun the dumb caterpillar is fun.
Misha 20:55
Dumb? Oh, I love that caterpillar.
Tyler 20:57
Oh, he's just like, he's such a kid. He's like, he's more like a child. Like why? Why? Why?
Misha 21:04
To me he Seems like an arrogant old man.
Tyler 21:07
They're kind of the same old people and children are basically the same. Ask my cats.
Misha 21:16
wait, what's their age difference?
Tyler 21:19
I mean, it's a few years but the their spirit is one is
Misha 21:23
Yes, baby who's like a Yeah, a preteen. Who's annoying and then Oh, poor Julian.
Tyler 21:30
Yeah. Okay, so five for story. Fine with me animation. I think for animation
Misha 21:38
this is where it blows it out of the park. Is that the phrase?
Tyler 21:42
knocks it out of the park.
Misha 21:43
That's the one.
Tyler 21:46
for all those baseball people out there. Here's what here's what I wrote. I didn't take many notes actually, because I was just sort of like going along for the ride. But one note I did write is like this movie is like 100% animators just flexing their fucking muscles like
Misha 22:01
Beautiful. so fucking beautiful.
Tyler 22:02
Going crazy.
Misha 22:04
Okay, I will tell you you should get high and watch this movie because normally you're not paying so much attention to the backgrounds but that's all I could pay attention to throughout the whole movie and they're so beautiful. And just I mean I I mean it this one knocks it out of the park with animation knocks it out of the park I used that correctly.
Tyler 22:25
they were they were crushing it like this in 1951 like and obviously
Misha 22:31
Every part of it was beautiful.
Tyler 22:32
Yeah. And it's cool because I mean again like not talking from a amateur perspective but like there are these scenes around the you know the Tea Party were crazy shit is happening in there animating all this crazy motion like like the the jam and the butter and the sea and everything in a broken clock and
Misha 22:51
Do you remember when he hits it, and then it turns black and white as it goes.
Tyler 22:54
Yeah, that was awesome.
Misha 22:57
like, like sober mind blown. And then just all the little details throughout the whole thing like the rabbits, the white rabbits house all of the furniture being rabbit themed and yeah, I don't know just all the backgrounds were so beautiful in addition to the main things that you're supposed to be looking at and I loved I loved it.
Tyler 23:18
I can't fault it at all. Where as with like Aladdin, I noticed mistakes with this. I didn't
Misha 23:26
none.
Tyler 23:27
And I mean, I just gotta really I've got a soft spot for this like classic like hand drawn with the way that like the like the queen and the Mad Hatter look, the fucking Goofy looking faces they've got I just love that.
Misha 23:40
And the way with the characters that weren't animals, and we're like, who weren't people that they could emote so well. Like, so impressive.
Tyler 23:51
Yeah, even like the fuck how much oysters would like barely a face.
Misha 23:55
Oh my god, I talk about those oysters...
Tyler 23:58
callooh callay!
Misha 24:00
Because, because So Steve, my husband and I are vegetarian and he will cheat for bivalves and like, eat bivalves. And every once in a while I'm like, You know what I should too, like we have in New York, this organization called the Billion Oyster Project. And they're trying to restore oyster reefs here. And they work with restaurants and they partner with like oyster farmers and stuff like that. And it's like if you eat oysters, it actually improves our waters, right rather than just taking from the waterways. Because they collect all of the shells and then put the back to build more reefs to clean the water, yada yada yada. And I keep thinking, Oh, okay, maybe I'll just have oysters from like one of these partners, and then I picture those little oysters with their bonnets, like being so sad that I'm going to eat them and I can't do it.
Tyler 24:51
Yeah, I used to love the walrus just because I think walruses are hilarious, especially animated versus they always look like Like, like, like This wall was sounds like
Misha 25:01
Wilford Brimley
Tyler 25:02
Wilford Brimley like a British Wilford Brimley. But he was so menacing this time around. I noticed I didn't notice it before. Yeah.
Misha 25:12
He's a baddie.
Tyler 25:13
Like, yeah, that and like the flowers. It's not my favorite part. I actually find I find the flower song a bit boring, but like that is really beautiful.
Misha 25:21
Can you guess whose favorite scene that was?
Tyler 25:24
Steve, if I just had
Misha 25:26
He gasped when it started, and was so enthralled, like, for the rest of it, he was like on this phone and doing seven it started. He didn't look at his phone during that whole song during that whole scene with the flowers. And he was just staring.
Tyler 25:41
Was he just...
Tyler 25:42
He can't even open his eyes that wide
Tyler 25:43
...naming the flowers.
Misha 25:45
He what he didn't have to because in the song they go through like, you know, the daffodil, the dandelion and he was like, all of these are correct! And he was very impressed.
Tyler 25:56
I figured he'd be hitting them before they got them in the song. But yeah, I don't know. That song...
Misha 26:00
He was just like quiet and listening.
Tyler 26:03
Yeah, so I don't know. What should we get for that? Because it has like these beautiful slow moments that's really done. Well, ten?
Misha 26:11
Yes. Because Okay, I'm gonna say ever since I was a kid, when they dunk the plate in the T and then bite it. I'm like, okay, all I want to do is eat a plate.
Tyler 26:20
Yeah. And cut the...
Misha 26:21
I want to. Cut the teacup in half?
Tyler 26:23
Yeah,
Misha 26:24
all I want to do is eat a fucking plate. They meet the that's a 10 we're giving it a 10. Okay, are we?
Tyler 26:32
All right. All right.
Misha 26:34
Are you asking?
Tyler 26:36
That was like, that was a not a rhetorical question. But a semi rhetorical question. We're giving it A 10. Okay. Let's see.
Misha 26:43
The other thing is when she's walking through the woods. And it's nighttime, because who knows what was actually happening? Yes. And all the signs one of the signs said yonder dislike what a cute choice.
Tyler 26:58
Nice
Misha 26:58
anyway.
Tyler 26:59
Yeah, it's like, yeah, no, it's it's very whimsical, very silly. Even though I mean, the Cheshire Cat. I fucking love as a as a kid.
Misha 27:10
And all of that like supporting animals, right like the flamingo the croquet flamingos are so cute. And the hedgehogs are so cute.
Tyler 27:17
Yep. All the different birds are so many different fucking birds in this like the birds in the bird. It's a cage. The birds that are hammers, the birds that are pencils. The all the different umbrella birds. Okay. I mean, are we really gonna go for 10? Here? I would say I was gonna say like, eight or nine. But okay,
Misha 27:40
I'm gonna make a comment. Do you think the animation I know this is sort of crossing categories. Do you think the animation of this is better than the music in a Goofy Movie? That is the highest...
Tyler 27:55
Yeah, that's the highest score you've given anything away and Aladdin. The genie got a nine. Gene. You got a nine two? Yeah. I would put the I would give it a nine. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. You could convince me to put a 10 I don't know. It just seems like there aren't problems with the animation. Yeah, that's true. i
Misha 28:16
It's Great.
Tyler 28:17
I'm just I guess I just hesitant to give a perfect score. But what Okay, here's my thinking. I'm coming around to it. I still don't think it's a 10. But I say that we should I say we should go with that gut feeling because that's what we did with a Goofy Movie. And that's what...
Misha 28:31
We're giving in a 10.
Tyler 28:32
We're giving it a 10. Yeah, I'm gonna get a 10 All right, we may be wrong. Well, we'll be wrong together. It's
Misha 28:39
- Okay. First of all, we can't be wrong because this is correct. Whatever we've done is just factually, objectively Correct.
Tyler 28:50
That's true. And this is, you know what, I think we're a little too averse to giving, like, like, yeah, I don't know, credit where credit's due.
Misha 28:58
I don't know. I feel like we give ones up the wazoo.
Tyler 29:01
Yeah. If they deserve it, yeah, I guess but yeah, like in this case. It deserves a 10 and we shouldn't be afraid to give like I don't know fucking Brother Bear a nine. I have no idea. I've never seen it. We'll see how it is. But
Misha 29:14
Jesus neither have I.
Tyler 29:17
Okay, yeah. Okay.
Misha 29:20
Perfect. Great. Perfect score. It says I think it deserves a perfect score. Yeah,
Tyler 29:25
and it's not going to get a lot of points in a couple other categories obviously. So yes, fine. Giving it a 10. Music and sound I think this should be pretty high. I honestly don't
Misha 29:34
I agree.
Tyler 29:35
Think most of the songs are very good, but the sound
Misha 29:39
I disagree.
Tyler 29:41
Like the unbirthday song is good Twinkle twinkle little bad is good. But like I Alice's for a song is horribly boring.
Misha 29:49
No it's not.
Tyler 29:50
it's awful it's so bad
Misha 29:52
I don't know. I don't know if it's because I watched this as a kid but I do know that's why so I wanted started either. Watch this at all. On time, and when it started, I was singing along and talking along with it. And I was like, shocked that I remembered any of it and I'm looking at Steve if like, I know all the words to this movie. Like didn't Well, maybe at least the beginning. I think it's cute. I think the music is cute. Even the boring songs. I mean, first one, it's charming.
Tyler 30:23
The first one is so boring. And in the one that she's singing with the flowers, the flowers shutter up because she's such a bad singer, which I thought was funny.
Misha 30:31
which is so cute, though. Yeah, it's not that I in a charming way. Like she like her voice cracks and she realizes she's bad. I don't know.
Tyler 30:41
Yeah, she's not like Lady Amalthea. And Last Unicorn for those who have seen that movie. It's like, like, oh, tone deaf, earnestly tone deaf.
Misha 30:52
Don't you ever say anything bad about that movie.
Tyler 30:55
I love the Last Unicorn. I love that movie. So much. Like every part of that was great.
Misha 31:00
That would get a perfect 10 Except for bipoc representation. But that's not a Disney movie.
Tyler 31:10
I mean, here's my opinion about this. Like, yeah, that's true. Is that a? Is that a Ralph Bakshi movie? Who made that movie? Oh, boy. It's kind of got like a hobbit look to it.
Misha 31:23
Yeah, yes. Okay, I've been watching...
Tyler 31:27
Rankin/Bass. It's a rankin. It's a Rankin/Bass the other of the other? Yeah, yeah. Hobbit thing. Yeah.
Misha 31:34
The Lord of the Rings. Yeah, the Lord of the Rings. Right Bass's Lord of the Rings. And then he was like, they were like, No, you can't make any more because it's fucking weird.
Tyler 31:43
Yeah. Yeah.
Misha 31:47
Okay, let's get back to Alice in Wonderland. Oh, I think it should rank fairly high.
Tyler 31:52
Yeah, I mean, for the sound alone. Like I think the sound is really great like the sounds of Tweedledee and Tweedledum make and the little like, our horn, duck and a little car horn ducklings. Like all the little sounds are great. I wouldn't give it like a nine. I would say something lower than that. But
Misha 32:11
seven?
Tyler 32:12
Yes, seven sounds fine to me. protagonist that here's where we maybe have an issue. Because
Misha 32:22
I know
Tyler 32:23
I really don't like Alice really don't like her
Misha 32:26
She immediately. So she's going into this because she's curious and fun and cute and is like so and I love that part. I like her at the beginning. And then she immediately just like after the Tea Party is like Boo fun. That was that was too crazy. And I'm like, Okay, that was the best fucking part of this whole thing. Like, all this nonsense. I don't know. And then she just turns into a total grump when she gets serious.
Tyler 32:55
Yeah, it's almost like I don't know. It's like,
Misha 33:01
So are you telling friends of ours that we're going to watch it and my friend Katey. Hi, Katey. She goes, she's gonna be listening. She goes, Oh, our household didn't like Alice in Wonderland. It's too weird and silly for us. And then while I was watching it, I was like, oh, when Alice turned serious, that's my friend Katey. Just yeah, play like, it's like I've had enough nonsense. It's nonsense for me.
Tyler 33:30
It's like a parent's perspective. Like, at some point, it's it's almost like a parent saying like, okay, like, it's fun to be silly. But now you have to brush your teeth. And right, like, do your homework.
Misha 33:44
Yuck
Tyler 33:45
and that's all that's Barfi Zilla so gross.
Misha 33:49
Yeah, listen, it's like you can live in this like cuckoo crazy world. Or go back to doing homework... bye I'll sleep forever.
Tyler 33:58
But then when she goes back to and the older sister I think I don't think it's a mom. I think it's an older sister. Yeah, it tells her to recite something and see she starts reciting the crocodile rhyme. So I like that. I don't know. She just like
Misha 34:11
dreams are powerful.
Tyler 34:13
Yeah, we don't talk enough about how like, crazy dreams are like, so much of our lives are fucking bonkers. And we don't understand them and we usually forget them when we wake up dreaming
Misha 34:26
I'm pretty good at remembering my dreams.
Tyler 34:28
I'm not I wake up and like I gotta tell Asli my wife this and then I immediately forget, but like, I feel like this. This is like not original. This is not a Tyler super original hot take but dreams are fucking crazy. Like, so much of our lives are just like it's like it's like a third of our lives is insane hallucinations the fuck you
Misha 34:49
I wish it could be more.
Tyler 34:50
humans are weird.
Misha 34:51
I love dreaming. Well don't dogs and cats dream? I mean,
Tyler 34:56
oh yeah.
Misha 34:56
Who knows?
Tyler 34:57
Well, I mean they do they look like they do from
Misha 35:00
I think it's just like muscle. Memory twitching. I remember dreams from when I was like four years old. I remember the first night the first dream I had. I had a lot of nightmares when I was kid. So it's like,
Tyler 35:12
I do remember some pretty and I have some recurring nightmares that I still sometimes have that I had as a kid, too, but most of them involve getting like a bird shit on me.
Misha 35:25
I have recurring dreams that are so horrible one is where my brakes fail on my car and like I'm driving is fucking out of control. It's horrible. And the second one is where my teeth are falling out. And I'm like spitting them like spitting seeds. Like I know,
Tyler 35:40
I feel like that means something. I don't know some dream chart somewhere. You haven't been frugal enough with your savings.
Misha 35:51
Oh, okay. I don't know why there but
Tyler 35:55
I have this one or I I'm like in a this is a recurring nightmare. Like I'm in sort of like a Leave It to Beaver type suburban life. And I like wake up. And I were
Misha 36:05
that sounds like a nightmare.
Tyler 36:06
I've that's not the nightmare part. I've, I've got like, I've got like, I put on like the bathrobe and I go outside to get the newspaper that some like cute, like, adorable like newspaper boy like throws at my sidewalk. I pick it up and then I yawn and a bird shits in my mouth and I wake up.
Misha 36:24
Oh, fuck, that's not.
Tyler 36:28
And I always like wake up with that. I've had it like it's gonna be, you know,
Misha 36:32
like, and I don't know what movie this is for where somebody yawns and stretches and like, the robe opens and they're naked underneath. I thought that's what you were going to say,
Tyler 36:39
I've never seen that I've remembered never had a dream about like being naked somewhere in public.
Misha 36:45
Oh, neither have I but I do have dreams about like using the bathroom. Okay? This is like actually my upsetting reoccurring dream theme is where I'm using the bathroom and like a very public place and people can see it's like in the middle of a room and there are just people around, or like a stall that's only like, halfway up and so people can just walk by and look in, it's horrible.
Tyler 37:08
That's also like that's what American public bathrooms are like, like talking to living in a different country. Like any any foreigner who goes to to America always comment on that always obviously, but comments on well, like
Misha 37:21
the inch gap in the stalls where people just walk by and like, wave at you, and see your cooch.
Tyler 37:26
And totally see your dingle dangle.
Misha 37:27
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I'm gonna tell you one last nightmare, and then we'll get back to Alice in Wonderland.
Tyler 37:36
Yeah, we gotta get back on track.
Misha 37:38
When I was in high school, I had this dream. I must have been after I watched. What is it? monkeys? Monkeys? What is it? 13. Seven monkeys. 13 monkeys with Brad Pitt.
Tyler 37:50
12 Monkeys.
Misha 37:51
12 Monkeys. You know, however many monkeys or seven, right? He's in that too. I don't remember which movie it was. It was the monkeys one. And in my dream. He's chasing me and trying to kill me. And I'm flying away. But I'm stuck inside this house. And he's like, trying to come after me and we're trying to go. And then finally it was like really scary. He's like a serial killer. And then I wake up and I'm in my bed and I'm like, Oh, thank God, I'm okay. Then that my comforter, my sheets get ripped off of me and I look down and all my guts are like I'm cut open and my guts are outside of me. And he's standing over me with a knife and I swore I had woken up. That was the scariest dream
Tyler 38:36
Dream within a dream
Misha 38:36
Fuck Those are terrible. Anyway. I mean, this is a movie about a dream. So this is like, yeah, we're on point.
Tyler 38:45
We're on point. We're on topic. This
Misha 38:46
It's not even tangential.
Tyler 38:49
It is tangential because Alice? I mean, I don't know. I think she deserves like something like a three.
Misha 38:55
Oh, but she's cute. Can we give her a four?
Tyler 38:58
I mean, I guess I can't hold it against her because she is a kid. But
Misha 39:02
that's, that's the other thing. I will say. Like, at first I was like, Oh, she sucks. But then I was like, Wait, she's like, 8, 7, 5, 10 I don't really know how she's supposed to be and I'm terrible with that. But like
Tyler 39:14
11 I think,
Misha 39:15
but like, How realistic is it for a kid to be like, Whoo school. I went silly and fun and then to get scared quickly.
Tyler 39:23
Yeah, but she doesn't get scared. She has like she's just like, Oh, odd, yeah.
Misha 39:28
She gets sad.
Tyler 39:28
She cries.
Misha 39:29
No, she cries and she's like, I want to be home. I think you're being too harsh on her because,
Tyler 39:36
but then like, Yeah, she does cry twice. Because she cries in the woods when she's super lost and the Cheshire Cat helps.
Misha 39:42
Yeah,
Misha 39:43
all right, four fine.
Tyler 39:45
All right. I think it should be better but whatever. You're right a four.
Tyler 39:50
sidekick, you don't
Misha 39:52
Dinah.
Tyler 39:54
Okay, my favorite part of this movie is when when Alice falls into the hole and just says bye to Dinah like She's not scared. Dinah Yeah. Yeah, it's not a sidekick. That doesn't really count. I think so who's the sidekick? I don't know.
Tyler 40:12
Nobody.
Tyler 40:12
There's no sidekick in this movie. I would argue there's no side kicks. There's no villain. There's no henchmen.
Tyler 40:17
No the queen is the villain.
Tyler 40:19
The queen is a villain, but she's in like 10 minutes of the movie,
Misha 40:22
it doesn't matter. She's still the villain. And they mentioned her much earlier in the movie.
Tyler 40:27
Not much earlier. No, it's like five minutes before the Cheshire Cat mentions or like she's
Misha 40:32
He mentions her twice.
Tyler 40:34
I don't think you mentioned so the first time they meet.
Misha 40:36
Well, she's obviously the villain.
Tyler 40:38
She's the villain and her henchmen are cardguards.
Misha 40:40
We're on sidekick.
Tyler 40:42
I would give it a one. There's no sidekick.
Tyler 40:46
Fuuuuuck, I wrote Dinah. But you're right. She's just her pet cat.
Tyler 40:50
And Dinah's, not along on the adventure with her doesn't go through the hero's journey, as much as it is
Misha 40:55
You don't know that Dinah isn't licking her while she's sleeping.
Tyler 40:59
Well, yeah, but
Misha 41:00
what journey?
Tyler 41:01
she's not in this journey. I think the Cheshire Cat is closer to being the sidekick than
Misha 41:07
I actually thought Cheshire Cat was the henchmen because he's fucking shit up intentionally.
Tyler 41:14
Yeah, he does. Some Goofy things. I think like the the card guards are more henchmen than the Cheshire Cat.
Misha 41:21
I think it's the Cheshire Cat.
Tyler 41:23
He's he's an agent of chaos. He's not working for the queen. He's he's against the Queen
Misha 41:28
He's working against the Queen when he flips her over.
Tyler 41:30
yeah. He's He's pure just agent of chaos. I think he's not a henchman.
Misha 41:36
I love that. Yeah. All right.
Tyler 41:38
Okay, so I think sidekick Yeah, it's there isn't one so not really a score.
Misha 41:42
All right,
Tyler 41:43
villain. I mean, how great.
Misha 41:45
The queen is the villain and she's awesome.
Tyler 41:48
Yeah, I liked how She looks like somebody's uncle.
Misha 41:57
Okay, she does. I won't name names.
Tyler 41:59
Is she better than Jafar? You think?
Misha 42:01
What did Jafar get?
Tyler 42:02
Jafar got a- We gave Jafar Yeah, we gave Jafar a Six. Yeah. She's iconic yes. She's iconic for sure.
Misha 42:10
She's iconic too.
Tyler 42:12
That's why I said she. She's iconic.
Misha 42:14
Oh, yeah.
Tyler 42:16
But she's just not in it. And she's, she's silly, like everything else. Like, I mean, she's fun, but she's,
Misha 42:23
but she's angry.
Tyler 42:24
She's so angry. She's Yeah, she's like, Rosie O'Donnell in A League of Their Own. Just always yelling,
Misha 42:31
she reminds me of somebody I went to high school with, I'm not going to name names. I think she's just as good as Jafar. Maybe not. Let's give her a five.
Tyler 42:40
I mean, I don't know. I think Jafar maybe should score higher just because he's like, He's
Misha 42:46
scary. He's actually scary.
Tyler 42:47
he's like involved in the plot a lot. Like he's there as an antagonist for most of it.
Misha 42:52
I mean, if we say everything about like, relating to the plot, then everything gets a one. There's no plot.
Tyler 42:58
Well, sure. But But yeah, but we're not. But we're not connecting it to stories slash theme, I suppose. But
Misha 43:06
but also - Oh, the henchman is the King
Tyler 43:10
and King in the in the card. I think the card guards count even though they're bumbling bafoons.
Misha 43:15
alright. Anyways, let's go. Let's give her five. How about that?
Tyler 43:19
I think five is fine. Yeah, like I don't know if you've played this before and little plug this is not a sponsor. But for those who haven't played the game Disney Villainous, you should because it's a really fun board game, but she's like one of the she's one of the she's one of the villains you can play as in card. Her card guards are like a key component of her mission.
Misha 43:39
Tyler. I bought it and we haven't played it.
Tyler 43:42
Well, we'll find time. We'll try to. We'll try to find
Misha 43:45
Yeah right.
Tyler 43:46
It's also I don't know how to play a board game online. There's Tabletop Simulator, but it's not great. Anyway,
Misha 43:54
We'll get Peach to come over and we'll play with how you.
Tyler 43:57
you could do that. Yeah, she's more fun. Anyway, my my younger sister's the coolest person ever so.
Misha 44:04
Oh,
Tyler 44:06
she's my hero.
Misha 44:08
Oh, that's so cute. Oh, anyway,
Tyler 44:13
anyway, enough about that... henchmen? I don't know. They're not that interesting. I the the best part about the king is the fact that the rabbit keeps forgetting he exists.
Misha 44:27
Yes. Well verybody and he's like, don't forget the king. actually really love that. And the king.
Tyler 44:34
I do like to have the queen of hearts like a boss.
Misha 44:38
I do too.
Tyler 44:39
Just just running things and
Misha 44:40
I'm like I want to give her a higher score because she is just like, fuck you. My way. I'm the queen of all of Wonderland. Suck it King. Doesn't matter how angry I get.
Tyler 44:53
I guess we got to think about what a rescoring and I'm like she has no goal she has no like plot that is the hero was against
Misha 45:01
her goal is to have everything red
Tyler 45:04
and chop a bunch of heads
Misha 45:05
and to like yell at everybody
Tyler 45:07
so yeah so I guess should we give her higher points for her the simplicity of her goal and how easy it is to achieve it
Misha 45:14
yes I also like she was like Oh little girl and then she's like curtsy while you speak open your mouth wider like all the stupid things are so funny to me I like giving the Queen a six.
Tyler 45:28
I like the whole courtroom scene too where she's like, this is important. This is very important. Yeah. I'm telling all the birds. Okay, let's get - tie her with Jafar.
Misha 45:39
She's good at nonsense. Yeah,
Tyler 45:41
yeah,
Misha 45:41
she's good at nonsense. And that's sort of the point right? If we're talking about what's the point of her it's nonsense and she's good at it.
Tyler 45:49
Fury and nonsense and and potentially, like literally chopping heads off. So
Misha 45:54
she does chop heads off
Tyler 45:57
henchman, I would give this a bit lower.
Misha 46:00
I would say a three just because
Tyler 46:03
yeah, that sounds good to me,
Misha 46:04
There's not much to it. The king is cute. And that's where the points come from. But yeah, all right. Let's argue about strong female,
Tyler 46:12
Strong female lead. So she is - first female lead milestone.
Misha 46:17
Quick Going back. I just checked my notes about the courtroom scene. When they when they get the mouse and the open eye goes Twinkle, twinkle little bat and then the jury goes Twinkle Twinkle, twinkle, twinkle, twinkle, twinkle. Twinkle, twinkle. I liked a lot there. Yeah, Twinkle Twinkle. Twinkle, twinkle. Okay, sorry. That's laughing.
Tyler 46:42
That was good. I love the mouse's. I wish I could do impressions better because I love the mouse's voice. I love the Mad Hatter's sort of dopey voice that...
Misha 46:50
Ed Wynn plays the Mad Hatter and he is one of my favorite actors is so phenomenal. And we won't get to talk about his scene in Mary Poppins, which is unfortunate because that's one of the best
Tyler 47:04
we will get a repeat at least have a couple of people but definitely forget his name but the guy who does the voice for the Cheshire Cat is also Kaa from Jungle Book.
Misha 47:13
Alice is Wendy Darling from Peter Pan.
Tyler 47:17
Nice. Okay, so we're gonna have some people showing up. I think and I'm pretty sure the walrus the *wobbly noise* guy, he pops up see pops up somewhere again, I think. But
Misha 47:27
yes, on a diabetes commercial. Or anti diabetes commercial?
Tyler 47:33
well it's definitely, but it's definitely not pro diabetes commercial.
Misha 47:41
That's what all candy commercials are.
Tyler 47:44
But it's him. It's him like, saying like, I got diabeetus and like talking about some medicine. It's not like a sour patch kids commercial where he's like, get some diabetes kids. So
Misha 47:58
strong female lead. I like how in the category it says strong female like
Tyler 48:04
so because she should get points because she's the first female lead and it's 1951 like...
Misha 48:10
yes, Yes.
Tyler 48:11
Early movie like the first well, not the first protagonist in Disney.
Misha 48:15
Every lead in this is a female. We've got the sister right the teacher of Alice. We've got Alice we've got the queen.
Tyler 48:23
Yep. And we don't know the you don't maybe a lot of the mome wraiths and other creatures that
Misha 48:30
We don't know about the Cheshire Cat.
Misha 48:32
I mean, I didn't I didn't pay attention to pronouns while I was watching on everybody else but yeah, no, I think she's awesome. She's like, get bye. There's this rabbit. I'm gonna go do my own thing.
Tyler 48:32
We don't know.
Misha 48:47
Yeah. And then like when she's bored of something she maybe should ever have one. She's like, this is too silly for me. I'm out. Like this is dumb for me now. I'm moving on.
Misha 48:54
Yeah, I think we should give her high poi-. I think we should give it high points. It's a strong female lead. She's making her own decisions throughout the whole thing.
Misha 49:03
Good. Yeah, that's what I'm trying to say.
Misha 49:04
She stands up for herself. She stands up to the Queen, which is pretty fucking badass. Because that's the scary queen.
Misha 49:10
Yep. Yeah, I mean, I don't think that
Misha 49:13
And she yells at the caterpillar she yells at everybody who like bothers her.
Tyler 49:17
Yeah,
Misha 49:17
she like, I think she should get high points.
Tyler 49:20
I just... I agree that she should get high points. But
Misha 49:25
are you sexist?
Tyler 49:26
No, when I first - What are you talking about? Let me explain myself. When I first watched it, I was like, she doesn't I was I was anti Alice when I watched it, but as we've been talking, I'm like, Yeah, you're right that she but we need to remember. Okay, so looking beyond the petri dish, we need to remember other female leads that we will be seeing like, I don't know, I'm just saying like, not being sexist. I'm just saying like, let's think of the bigger picture
Misha 49:55
She's a child though.
Tyler 49:57
I do like how she like just as like I bored I'm moving on and like I don't like you. I'm moving on so but I just don't think it deserves she deserves like a nine or something. I don't I don't think it should be that high.
Misha 50:09
I would say an eight.
Tyler 50:13
Okay.
Misha 50:14
I think she states her opinions when she has them. She chooses that she's had enough nonsense like she's very clear in what she's looking for. She's. She stands up to the caterpillar.
Tyler 50:30
Yeah, that's fine with me. I was just arguing against something higher than that.
Misha 50:34
Okay.
Tyler 50:36
Cuz we got to we got to keep this like somewhat scientific. We can't go off the rails here. So eight sounds perfect.
Tyler 50:42
Okay,
Tyler 50:42
BIPOC representation portrayal. I think we can just move...
Misha 50:47
Give it a one.
Tyler 50:48
Move past this Yeah, like we repeat ourselves. We repeat ourselves a lot in this category. But unfortunately, one and what can we say? 1950s. Be less racist. And fun factor. I know what you're gonna say.
Misha 51:04
this is. You don't know me! Yeah. Okay. This is getting a 10 It's like exclusively fun. Like the whole point of the book. The whole point of the movie is just like, was it fun? Life sucks. Everything's Boring. Boring, boring. We're just making this a weird, old funny, silly fun thing.
Tyler 51:25
Yeah, to me,
Misha 51:27
Twinkle twinkle twinkle twinkle...
Tyler 51:28
It's not all about fun. It's all about silliness. And those are not always the same thing. But that's adult Tyler talking. So I'm fine.
Misha 51:36
Booo!
Tyler 51:37
I'm fine with giving it I mean, I just don't think like we I don't think it's as fun as a Goofy Movie. And that we gave a Goofy Movie. 10
Misha 51:44
The fuck!
Tyler 51:45
I didn't watch this movie high. So
Misha 51:47
if you think okay, first of all, I I also watched it sober. And I will say part of A Goofy Movie's. Fun is the music. And if it didn't have music, it probably would not have been as fun.
Tyler 52:02
Yeah, I would agree with that.
Misha 52:05
And so I would say okay, now you're I'm agreeing with you. It's a nine.
Tyler 52:10
Yeah, I think at nine makes sense to me. I mean, firstly, for me watching it today, it was lower than that, honestly. But I'm trying to, I'm trying to not let like personal funk, like affect the scores here. So say nine.
Misha 52:25
Okay, on a scale of one to 10 one being so funk that you're I don't want to say it 10 being.. wait no, now I'm getting mixed up.
Tyler 52:35
On a scale of one to Parliament. How funk is it?
Misha 52:39
How deep is your funk? I'm, like, average funk. Right? Or would you say it's like higher than average funk?
Tyler 52:47
You mean? My personal funk?
Misha 52:51
Like, are you representing the average human with your funk?
Tyler 52:54
Oh, no.
Misha 52:54
If So then, right. So then if so we don't even have to worry about your funk affecting this rating. Since this is purely 100%. Objective scoring?
Tyler 53:04
Yeah, it is.
Misha 53:05
we don't have to take that into consideration.
Tyler 53:07
Well, that's why I was putting it to the side because as a trained cultural anthropologist, who knows how to study other cultures looking over their shoulder, the book of their culture Geerts, fuck Geerts I can I know.
Misha 53:24
Tyler and I are both trained cultural anthropologists on paper,
Tyler 53:30
on paper
Misha 53:31
Let me tell you on paper. I don't fucking know the first thing about anything Tyler talks about.
Tyler 53:38
Anyway. What was I going to say? Fuck. Oh, I was just gonna say, Yeah, I'm, I'm gonna, I'm, you know, just in general these days, bad mood, but I'm putting that to the side and it's not affecting the score. So that's why I'm saying like, nine makes sense. Instead of like, today watching it. It was more of like a six for me. But that's, I think that's too low.
Misha 54:03
Now, I feel like it should be an eight. You're convincing me that maybe I didn't have as much fun.
Tyler 54:08
Well, no, I would say if you had a nines worth of fun, then that makes sense.
Misha 54:14
I wrote 10 While I was sober. What I didn't take notes while I was high because I can't
Tyler 54:19
Right.
Misha 54:20
And so
Tyler 54:21
I cannot let this
Misha 54:23
But that was early on. But I wrote it early on.
Tyler 54:26
Yeah, and also just as a I mean, this is again, I'm putting funk to the side but I was in a bad mood while watching a Goofy movie too. And fucking it
Misha 54:37
Because of the music.
Tyler 54:39
I think the whole the whole thing like the possum Park everything even Pete with voice
Misha 54:45
you know how I feel about Lester's Possum Park.
Tyler 54:48
And this like? I mean, I don't know it's it. Maybe it's because it's, like, slow and weird. It didn't really do it for me this time. I mean,
Misha 54:59
I was laughing a lot.
Tyler 55:00
The animation really did it for me, but
Tyler 55:02
All right, let's give it an EIGHT.
Tyler 55:04
Okay, we can always we can always sort of reevaluate in the midterms whenever those are. I mean, I'm fine with a nine too but maybe I should put my foot down because this podcast is you twisting my arm and and I changed my mind. So maybe this time it goes to an eight.
Misha 55:19
right, let's let's give it an EIGHT.
Tyler 55:21
Okay. Now we're on to the
Misha 55:26
Just FYI. Aladdin also got an eight.
Tyler 55:30
Oh, geez. I wanted to give that lower too I think but, but
Misha 55:34
all right
Tyler 55:34
now I don't remember. Maybe I'd maybe that's not what I said. Because the genie makes that movie a lot more fun than it really should be. Fuck Alice in Wonderland is more of a fun, unique thing than Aladdin, though.
Misha 55:46
Yeah.
Tyler 55:47
Sort of my mind is changing. It's
Misha 55:48
The genie is Super fun. So you're right. And there's a lot of fun parts to Aladdin. I think it is. I think they're tied. Yeah. All right. doesn't sit right. I don't think it.
Tyler 56:01
Yeah, I don't think there's anything
Misha 56:02
I don't think it doesn't sit right So 0 for doesn't sit right. It's not going to lose any points.
Tyler 56:07
It's not going to lose any points. Yeah.
Misha 56:09
Okay. effervescence
Tyler 56:11
Effervescence. I think this has that sort of weird I do. I'd like I've said whimsical like 400 times in this episode. So I think it's got it
Misha 56:18
Tingling tingling, tingling.
Tyler 56:20
I think it's got the full five bonus points to be honest.
Misha 56:23
Five?
Tyler 56:24
Despite the fact that I
Misha 56:25
It goes to ten.
Tyler 56:26
Oh, yeah, you're right. We gave we gave Christmas carol negative 10. So, right. Well, what I was about to say is like, although I don't think the fun factor is very high. I do think it's got this like extra more than a sum of its parts Disney magic to it.
Misha 56:38
Yes, I agree. But I would give it eight bonus points, because it really does have that.
Tyler 56:45
Yeah.
Misha 56:46
So Alice in Wonderland gets a total of 61 points out of 110. So okay, fair.
Tyler 56:56
Yeah.
Misha 56:57
Yeah, ties with A Bug's Life.
Tyler 57:01
We've got some,
Misha 57:03
like 60 and above is like, okay, it's a good movie.
Tyler 57:06
Yeah. Yeah, that's a solid D. And, you know, if it were like percentages out of 100 But yeah, but D for Disney.
Misha 57:16
Disney!
Tyler 57:17
D for dangerous.
Misha 57:19
D For dope.
Tyler 57:21
D for Dope. Yeah, dope, Disney.
Misha 57:23
D for da bomb.
Tyler 57:25
D for, Dingle.
Misha 57:27
Ew.
Tyler 57:28
yeah. sorry. Had to throw a gross one in there.
Misha 57:32
you know, I was worried because I was worried this would actually do a lot worse. And when we were talking about it.
Tyler 57:40
Yeah, I think it's just me being a grump. But I, some things I was thinking would be much lower. But then once we started talking about them, and it wasn't just the typical Misha, like, punches me in the kidney and makes me change my mind. Like I came around to like with Alice, I came around to it as I was talking about it. So the villain
Misha 57:58
She's a child.
Tyler 58:01
Are we happy with six for vill-? Yeah, we're happy with that. She's, she's as good as Jafar, if not better, so. Okay. Yeah, that's fine with me. 6- 61. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, yeah, I guess the thing is, we I have to, we have to look at each villain in their world as what and what they're all about, is if we grade her on Jaffar scale of like, the Machiavellian
Misha 58:25
then she should be higher
Tyler 58:26
-puppet master than
Misha 58:27
then she should be higher than Jafar, because she's in a world of nonsense, and she doesn't make sense. And she like flip flops and goes back and forth. And she's scary and angry and then immediately gets kind of cutesy like,
Tyler 58:41
Yeah, but she's also like, I mean, I don't know, like, but she's barely in the movie.
Misha 58:47
Oh right, yeah. That's a good point.
Tyler 58:49
She's, yeah, she's not given enough if she popped up like several times during this movie, like,
Misha 58:56
yeah, yeah, you're right.
Tyler 58:57
That woud be different. But. But that's just not the way the story is written. It's like episodes, as well. So
Misha 59:04
yeah. yeah.
Tyler 59:05
Next step is Atlantis The last empire. So that's...
Misha 59:10
There's only one Atlantis, right?
Tyler 59:12
Yeah, it's like...
Misha 59:13
Why would the first one have a subtitle?
Tyler 59:16
I don't know. Just does.
Misha 59:19
All right. Bye y'all.
Tyler 59:21
Bye. Hey, gang, Tyler here. Just wanted to say another. Thank you so much to all of you for listening and supporting the show Misha and I really appreciate it. Thank you so so so much, and if you liked the show, and you haven't subscribed yet, please consider doing so. And also any spreading of the word would be much appreciated. Tell your friends, tell your enemies and so on. And you want to get in touch with us the email and social media contact is in the episode description Oh given here to our email addresses [email protected] and @muchabupod on Twitter and Instagram. Once again, thank you so much for listening. Until next time