Please excuse the grammatical errors, any other errors you come across, and the general sloppiness of this transcription of Much Abu About Nothing's podcast episode on Hercules! Our episodes are transcribed by a robot.
Tyler 00:00
content warning although this is a podcast about kids movies, this podcast isn't for kids and may contain content some people find offensive
Misha 00:26
Welcome to Much Abu About Nothing podcast where we discuss and rate Disney films that are animated, going in alphabetical order following a rigorous and quantitative scoring system based on absolutely nothing. That gay was from Tyler.
Tyler 00:47
Yeah, I'm Tyler. And I
Misha 00:50
thought you were gonna do the same thing like that intro is that I'd be like, yeah, it's Ameesha.
Tyler 00:57
That would have been better. Let's take it back. Let's rewind. Let's rewind the tape. That intro. And that yeah, it was from Misha. Hello. Hey, how are you doing?
Misha 01:09
I am okay.
Tyler 01:11
I'm also okay. Crazy times.
Misha 01:13
It's very warm here. I went for a walk with Simon first thing in the morning instead of waiting for the afternoon. Because it would be too hot for assignment. So hot day to day here. In April, it's gonna hit ad. Wow. Celsius, Celsius over there.
Tyler 01:32
Yeah, but I'm bad at the conversion. Because it involves like taking out a loan. It's like plus 20 divided by
Misha 01:41
point 66666666 To infinity and beyond infinity
Tyler 01:49
and beyond. 26 is hot. Yeah, that's definitely hot here. I don't know what it is. But it just dropped again. It got cold again. So I don't know. It's all wacky here. Oh,
Misha 01:59
yeah. Here too. It shouldn't be at in April.
Tyler 02:02
I pray? Yeah. As they say it's pretty talking about it. We're talking about 99 D sevens? Correct me if I'm wrong?
Misha 02:14
Yes, that's correct. Hercules
Tyler 02:16
had a cles. From
Misha 02:20
Roman? Greek. Yeah. Kilyos.
Tyler 02:23
I guess because Hercules is a more well known name. So they chose that over Heroclix. I mean, for any people who are like, I'm actually mythology is my, this movie's not gonna do? Yeah.
Misha 02:37
I did not know. Maybe I did. Steve was just like, every little thing like, well, actually, that's not how Pegasus was formed. And actually, that's the Roman version of Hera, please. And I'm actually the whole time I was like, Okay, can I need to watch this movie? Yeah, that's not what Steve sounds like. But yeah, this for the
Tyler 02:58
podcast. Yeah. I mean, yeah, Steve. Hi, Steve. He's got a more like, sultry voice. But yeah, saying like, I'm actually but that doesn't sound like it'd be there but
Misha 03:16
Steve saying sultry thanks to him. Look, Tyler
Tyler 03:18
dreams of Steve is not a bad name for a movie halogens a Steve. I might I'm actually a little bit in this because we have a semi recurring thing called folk FX, which may be well, there might be a little bit of a yeah effects. But
Misha 03:33
I didn't. I was like, I can't I don't have time for this many folk facts. It's all folk. The two thing is one long folk. That's all one long some other folk facts. And
Tyler 03:43
so if anybody is like, I mean, if anybody really cares about Greek mythology, this isn't maybe the movie for you. They're loosey goosey with the myth, but it's myth So who the fuck cares, right? Yeah,
Misha 03:55
exactly. Right. It's all bullshit.
Tyler 03:56
I mean, Greece got booze. They will
Misha 03:58
be dropping. Not a fun fact. Oh, for sure. Not a far fact. Not a fish fact. Ah, feather fact okay.
Tyler 04:15
That was my beating, beating featherweights let's get into get into it. So welcome, everybody to the show the newcomers and old comers and all comers. We rate these movies on different categories.
Misha 04:30
Speaking of Zeus and commerce, Jesus Christ, I mean, yep. Hercules.
Tyler 04:38
Zeus
Misha 04:40
I wonder how they came up with the story of Jesus,
Tyler 04:43
Jesus. That's good. We write these movies on different category like different categories giving scores from one to 10 without looking originality, story, animation, music and sound for tagging This sidekick villain henchmen strong female lead bipoc representation slash portrayal and fun factor and then minus points for doesn't sit right and bonus points for effervescence. That's special Disney magic. Giving up total out of 110
Misha 05:17
I think he did. You did? You did?
Tyler 05:21
Oh, who? Hercules? What movie was that Hercules Hercules. It was some Eddie Murphy movie.
Misha 05:30
Oh, the collapse or something like that
Tyler 05:32
nutty professor. Yeah, or something like that.
Misha 05:34
That's it. Yeah. Okay. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah.
Tyler 05:38
Well, let's without further ado, let's get into it. There have been some people waiting for this episode. Upon bated breath. So let's Yeah, yeah, I mean, me. Yeah, I've got a massive painful boner right now for this episode.
Misha 05:52
So good. Just like Danny DeVito and every other fucking character in this shitty movie, okay.
Tyler 05:59
included the characters, including the character is literally a bulging, like veiny Wiener, but we'll get into that.
Misha 06:08
Oh my god. So gross. Oh, god. Okay,
Tyler 06:12
so what happens in in Hercules?
Misha 06:15
So Hercules is just about a. A bunch of perverts. And yeah, that's it. It's just perverts galore. Everywhere you go. It's pervert here, pervert there. That's a pervert. He's pervert. She isn't a pervert. But twice. In a row. do buy pervert. Pervert. perverts perverts? The Ed.
06:39
Wow.
Misha 06:40
I'll give you a better one.
Tyler 06:43
If someone hadn't seen the movie lately. What might we? Could we elaborate? That's basically it though. That's a pretty good synopsis.
Misha 06:50
Thank you. So all right. All right. Zeus and Hera have a baby. His name is Hercules. Yep, up crossing languages. So Hercules gets kidnapped by Hades. Minions. Yep. Pain and panic. Yes. Why can they kidnap him? And they're supposed to turn him why? Oh, because Jesus, who cares? Okay, so maybe Jesus please goes to these witches. Actually, not who cares? Because these witches are off the face. They are my favorite part of this so good. And they have this they can see the future. They can see the past they can see present they can see all time. And they tell Hades because he begs them to
Tyler 07:39
watch sees the present kind of dumb though. I mean, like, I mean, she's still cool. Looks cool. But isn't that the worst of the three? Like, listen, that's like saying the past the worst one.
Misha 07:49
That's like saying, Oh, my middle is the worst one. But the top and bottom are okay. You know, it's one. It's one of it's good. All right. All right. And so they tell Hades that Hercules is going to stop him from having total dominion over everything. And so Hades is like, Go kidnap this baby. Turn him mortal. They try to feed this baby. They bring the baby to earth and they feed him. This potion that is supposed to turn a mortal but the only way for it to work is I used to drink every drop. But then a couple of people start strolling around the corner for their evening pasta, John, and they run pain and panic runaway. And there was one tiny little drop left in the vial. Baby Hercules didn't drink. So he's not totally mortal. He's just a little bit mortal. He's lost his god status. But he still has God's strength. Yep. And so he is adopted by those two people. Because they said they prayed to the gods that they could have a baby. And then here is Hercules. So he's raised. His parents are now a human couple. And he's on Earth. Fucking up left and right. Yeah, he's awkward and ugly and looks like Jonah Hill. Did you notice he looks like Jonah Hill. I looks like once once you see it, I'm very good at that game. I can say that person looks like that person all the time. And I'm very good at it. Once you see it, you cannot unsee I
Tyler 09:41
see it now. Yeah, I did not clock it was so good on you. Awful.
Misha 09:45
It. Just have you looked up Jonah Hill lately.
Tyler 09:51
I mean, he looks fit. Like he's he's gotten in shape. He
Misha 09:54
went on so he's on a weird journey. Oh,
Tyler 09:58
it's like a wild wild country too. everything. Oh show so um,
Misha 10:01
you gotta just look up. Jonah Hill.
Tyler 10:04
What am I supposed to write Jonah Hill picks? Jonah Hill.
Misha 10:07
Jonah Hill, Jonah Hill. Do you know how to use the internet?
Tyler 10:12
I'm I'm searching for Google. And then I'm searching for Google Images. No, just oh my
Misha 10:19
god. What's
Tyler 10:20
going on? That's must be
Misha 10:23
for a movie. No.
Tyler 10:25
i The one that's like a weird sort of like Miami Vice he's wearing. Yes. He's wearing a jacket with
Misha 10:31
no shirt, though. I mean, there's so much I don't know.
Tyler 10:36
I mean, yeah, what I mean, he just like he lost a lot of weight and he like looks like he's like working out now. But yeah, what is going on with the frosted? Okay, this is a journey I can't go to he looks like a younger Jimmy Buffett.
Misha 10:50
I'm sending you a picture in the chat. Oh, no.
Tyler 10:57
Shoe style cover. Okay. So, so what he looks like is he looks like a 90s teen from like, all grown up, but he hasn't changed anything about himself. So yeah. You know, he looks like this. He looks like that jerk who calls Hercules Hercules. And with that blond hair. There's one kid kid. There's one kid who looks really gross.
Misha 11:27
I wrote notes about that particular teen. Yeah. And Gosling sprayed throw up everywhere. Yeah, that kid is that one teen. Um, where was I? They were just so gross. Okay, so Hercules is a teenager and everyone is just disgusting. If I hated teens before, I can't even comprehend or measure how much I hate teens. Now. Imagine. Oh, it's awful. Go.
Tyler 11:58
There's some. Yeah, for people who don't like to use. Just quick. Tyler Tyler with the teens corner. That's not me just wandering. It's so gross. Back to the original podcast. Yeah, for those who hate pervs. There's like, all right, there's like
Misha 12:16
audience can see the listeners could see Tyler's face.
Tyler 12:25
Very familiar to the familiar defeat. But yeah, for teen haters. There's like five minutes of like, a Gora.
Misha 12:33
Oh my God, was it really only five minutes?
Tyler 12:35
It was I mean, just around there. Like it was my notes. I
Misha 12:38
was like, what was this an hour long of just Hercules as a teen?
Tyler 12:43
It did go on.
Misha 12:45
I mean, the healer with the team the whole beginning.
Tyler 12:48
Where was I gross teens?
Misha 12:50
Oh, God, then what happened then? So everybody hates him? deservedly. Because he sucks. Then he's like, Ah, I'm Ciao Jack. Oh, I'm gonna hate me. And then he figures out that he is the son of Zeus with this medallion that his parents give him saying when we found you. You had this medallion? It's the same symbol as zoos. Why weren't they just upfront with him in the beginning? I don't know. I won't get into the whole adoption thing. Anyway, so he goes and talks to a statue of Zeus and Zeus comes to life and says, and this all happened so fast. Yes, you're my son. You can't be a God. Because you have to prove yourself a true hero because you were mortalized. And then the only way to become come back to us is to become a God by becoming a true hero. Have fun. Here's oh, by the way, here's Pegasus. Uh, you know each other by Yeah, very fast. It was and then Oh, and you have to go find potete pataka glow. And so he is like, okay, gets on Pegasus. Pegasus flies him over to Danny DeVito whose pet tic tac we
Tyler 14:03
can say Phil. Phil like to tease the lock. Thank
Misha 14:06
you say Phil, and he finds him for fun like thank you Philip. TDs he finds Phil masturbating in the bushes looking at some ladies
Tyler 14:22
nymphs. Like it's nips. Thank you. It's like a I don't know if it was purposeful but like a very, like a shout out to Fantasia. It's very like a Fantasia shot of those like, except
Misha 14:33
the Cupid's are like I'm trying to hook you up with other nibs whereas Danny DeVito is hiding in the bushes masturbating and it's disgusting. And I kept what? And then Hercules is like, hey, Phil, I need your help. And he's like, oh, and the, the nymphs are like, Oh my God, there's this Seder in the bushes. masturbating to us and they run away and Phil gets mad there Hercules caught him or like, disrupted his pervy. sesh. Yep. And Hercules says, ignores all of that. Yes, all men and ignores it doesn't say, Hey, don't be a pervert, like, why are you just like watching them? Like, that's disgusting. Don't do that. Hercules just ignores it and lets him no problem. Sure, do what you want. But I need your help to train me. Phil says no. Hercules says yes. They do this back and forth. Danny DeVito sings a song which he shouldn't do, and then finally agrees to help out Hercules. Fast forward, Hercules becomes grown up Hercules while that's not even a montage, he just all of a sudden has grown up. And he can do all the things because Phil training,
Tyler 15:55
there's a training run as a training montage, like flying through hoops
Misha 15:59
and training montage. But Hercules is the same age and then all of a sudden, he's a grown man. I
Tyler 16:05
mean, it's, I mean, it's so the montage like leads to him like suddenly being older and and now he's a himbo.
Misha 16:16
I guess it's in like in The Lion King. Anyway. Fine. It was better than the Lion King. And so Hercules has grown up. He's famous. No, he's not famous yet. He goes, and has to now do some Hero stuff. And while he's around, he meets a mag and likes her. Then he some subs.
Tyler 16:43
He meets her she's she's in the middle of being perturbed on by center. God, everybody's
Misha 16:48
such a pervert. And
Tyler 16:51
he's he he rescues her but she says I don't need your rescuing. But he, he deals with the center and then the audience finds out that Meg is working for Hades. That's when that happens. And they know that at that point, yeah, after the center because she Meg went to go talk to the center to get the center on Hades aside, and Hercules Hercules fucks everything up. So she goes back and says I would have done it. But this idiot Hercules got in the way and Hades is like, say that name again.
Misha 17:19
And then Hades goes, Yeah, Hades goes, Wait a second. I told my minions to murder Hercules. What do you mean Hercules? And pain and panic or like, oh, Lulu,
Tyler 17:32
or shall we say,
Misha 17:33
Mercury's? I don't get it. No.
Tyler 17:37
Okay. Fine. Merc like you mark somebody. You take them out anyway.
Misha 17:41
Okay. You mean? No.
Tyler 17:44
You never heard them for like, they're gonna murder him. Anyway, whatever. But yeah, that's just wanted to. I wanted to add that because that's like a very important plot point.
Misha 17:54
Well, I know it is with Meg, but I didn't realize that happened. So anyway, but Hercules doesn't know that Meg is working for Haiti. So then Hades, this whole plot to trap Hercules and mag is like, hey, Hercules. There's these two little boys who are stuck under a rock helped me oh, we need to help them. Oh, my God, like me. I'm so hyper sexualized. Oh, my God. And then Hercules is like, oh, yeah, I'm like, tough got machismo. I'm gonna go save these little kids. And he saves the kids from this rock. But guess what, it's pain and panic. Disguised as little children. And then Hercules everybody's chanting like Hercules Hercules. And then from that cave where the little kids were trapped supposedly a legit kids were trapped. Yep. A Severus comes out. Right? Is that what they're called? A Hydra? Was a Hydra. Cerberus
Tyler 18:51
is the three headed dog that guards Hades. Hey,
Misha 18:55
Cerberus.
Tyler 18:57
No surprises Cerberus is the three to duck This is the learning in Hydra.
Misha 19:02
Okay, all right. Okay.
Tyler 19:03
Thank you. So anyway, another,
Misha 19:08
another. Yeah. So, Hercules chops off the head, and then more keeps popping out popping out popping out when he kills it eventually. Now everybody's like, Oh, this
Tyler 19:19
guy who's this guy? Yeah.
Misha 19:21
Whoa. And Hades is like, god dammit. Did you know I was trying to kill Hercules? Oh, but you know, I'm gonna figure something a lot. Anyway, Herculis become super famous at like a celebrity. And he's like, Okay, I'm a hero. I can be a God now and his dad is like, No. Does it make you a hero? So then Hercules is like, back to the drawing board. I don't know what happens. He meets mag again. They start to genuinely fall in love.
Tyler 19:52
Yeah, can I add one thing? So here at this point, Zeus is like to be a true hero. You need to discover that for yourself at the end of the movie. He He says like how to become a true hero. He could have just told Hercules from the beginning. Like at the very end, he's like you found out. This is how you become a true hero. It's all about blah, blah, blah. And like he could have just given Hercules or something. It's about like the strength of your heart. He could have just given Hercules a hint. You didn't need to anyway. Yeah,
Misha 20:18
he did say look inside yourself. Look into you. And so Hades is like, hey, Meg. You're supposed to do this stuff. I own you because her last boyfriend was dying or something. Yeah. And Meg was like, take me instead. And he was like, okay, and then that pervert was just like, Oh, I found another girl to DJ isn't too bad, fucking Med, whatever. And then Meg was heartbroken. But she's still in servitude to Hades. So now she's falling in love with Hercules even though she swore off men. She can't help it her loins ache for Hercules. And, but she still has to trick him and trap him. Yep. She doesn't have a choice.
Tyler 21:12
She doesn't have a choice.
Misha 21:13
That's what this movie is about. Women don't have choices. And so what's next? Well, she
Tyler 21:20
does eventually say, I'm not going to do it. Forget it. But then Hades is like, fine. I'm just gonna use you as bait then, because I still like him a god and call you Yeah. So yeah, doesn't work. Then
Misha 21:32
he tells Hercules. Something's happening. And Haiti shows up to Hercules. And he's like, Oh, give up your power for 24 hours. And Hercules is like, why would I do that? And he's like, you know, please. And are you is like, no, and Hades goes. Okay, since I asked you nicely, and you said no. Instead, Meg appears, I'm going to merge this bitch. You don't do what I say. And Hercules is like, Oh, I love her. Okay. And then Haiti says, Guess what? She's been working for me this whole time. She trapped you and tricked you, and you're an idiot. And then Hades goes on his mission to have total control over everything sets all the Titans loose to go after Zeus to get Zeus to get all the gods who freeze all the horses on Earth and take over. So then they do that. Yeah, they capture all the gods. They freeze all the horses. Lava is everywhere. And Hades is like, yes, it did it. But rewind a little bit. I forgot to mention, part of the deal that Hades made with Hercules was that he wouldn't hurt mag in the process of
Tyler 23:02
Yes, he did agree to that
Misha 23:04
password. So Hercules is is powerless. And he's about to be squashed by a column. And mag is like I love you. All I care about is the love of men and then pushes Hercules out of the way. And she gets hurt. Oh, Hades. Bad news. You didn't see this coming. Mag sacrifice yourself got hurt. So your deal broken.
Tyler 23:33
He's got his strength or Hercules. Hercules
Misha 23:35
gets his power. Yeah, Hercules gets his strength back goes by Hades. Bada bing bada boom gets bout Oh, before that,
Tyler 23:46
the end is the end is very like the it's like when it's like when Aragorn shows up with all those ghosts. Like suddenly the battle is just over. The there's no climactic fight. It's just like, oh, Hercules is here now. Right? Like the The jig is up? And yeah. And then suddenly, Zeus is Thunderbolts work again, but whereas they were totally ineffectual before, because
Misha 24:06
he because well, no, because they cut the god chains off of them. They all had like Hades chains. Yeah, but
Tyler 24:17
before that handcuffs before like when the when the those handcuffs were put on there after they were all captured though. Like people like when the Titans were climbing up. It was also fast was throwing lightning bolts at the Titans and they're just pinging off but then suddenly, when, when, like they're rescued, he throws one and like the Titans because power of love, love.
Misha 24:41
Power of Love. Yeah,
Tyler 24:42
that's a big powerful theme in this movie, the power of love. It's
Misha 24:45
the power of love. And Hercules wins and then he is okay what? But Meg gets crushed by the column and she dies My favorite part also is the back to the witches. They cut your string between living
Tyler 25:06
and dead. It is really cool.
Misha 25:08
Thanks so much. They Yeah, so they when they that tether gets cut, you're dead mags tether gets cut. She's in the underworld. So Hercules after defeating Hades has to go to the underworld to get mag back. He goes, and Hades goes, Sure go swim into this death pool. You can go get her. If you you know, Hercules is like, oh, take me and said, Yeah, okay. And then he's like, Oh, you're gonna die in the death books at death pool kills people. Yeah, makes sense. He's dives down to go get mega and he starts to die. Big news, everybody. That was the heroic act that turned Hercules into a God. So he doesn't die. He saves Meg. He takes Meg soul out of the pool of death, puts her soul back into her corpse because that's how it works. Yep. And she's alive. So now he's a god. Yeah, he just lowers her. Ghost in into her body. That's how it works. Her organs are all crushed. She is has severe internal bleeding. She's probably concussed doesn't matter, but that's all back it. She'll just suffer for the rest of her short life. And he's welcomed in back into Mount Olympus with the gods. And he's like, hurray, I've wanted this my whole life. And then Meg is like, Mom, I'm being left again. Oh, man knows men will stay with me. And he's like, Oh, okay. She kind of does. Yeah, she does. She says it like that. Like, Oh, who cares? Or your God, I'm alone again. And all I need is the validation and love of a man. And then he goes, Okay, I will give up being a god amongst gods to be with my one true liar. I mean, love, Meg. And then stays on Earth for her. He's reunited with his parents, his human mortal parents. Happily ever after
Tyler 27:31
he becomes a constellation. So yeah, he's immortalized in the stars. And yeah. And then there's a Michael Bolton song.
Misha 27:42
So everybody wins. So, you know, every buddy wants his parents, his birth parents, Zeus and Hera who've been waiting to be reunited. Fuck you. He's staying on earth so he can stick his dick and Meg.
Tyler 28:04
Several urge
Misha 28:07
shout out Tyler. Yeah,
Tyler 28:09
as far as I remember the in this story. Hercules is 18 because they said something right. The fate say in 18 years the planets will align. So he's an 18 year old teenagers. He's an 18 year old limbo. Thinking your
Misha 28:26
teenage self? Say you couldn't be a god. Where you can get your dick wet. Of course, you're gonna say teenagers is the dumbest cat in long these movies are about teenagers. I mean,
Tyler 28:40
a lot of these are about like the the stupid decisions we make when we are like super horny. Basically, like it's funny. I mean, people are not fashionable when they Aladdin
Misha 28:51
No. Juliet yeah cars oh god cars cars
Tyler 28:58
to Mater especially like being horny for shift. Well, jobs first movie dogs first movie is is a gross, badly drawn wet dream. Yeah. In one version of the Heroclix myth, he's given a choice between a life of normal like a sort of like peasants life that's going to be safe and happy but like, quote unquote, boring and a tumultuous, violent but glorious life and he's like, the latter please. Of course, because you know, he's Hercules. Also fun folk fact. He murders Meg in the myth and all their children because hair apparently Hara makes him because her hair is constantly Oh yeah,
Misha 29:46
they're awful. Oh my god. Sorry. You're
Tyler 29:48
awful you're a makes him go crazy. And he shall come back to her
Misha 29:53
because she's got like weird mommy son issues.
Tyler 29:55
I don't know cuz he's not here as son. Zeus. Fuck Got Swan or something, or I noticed talked to swan. Zeus as the swan. I don't remember if the swan is part of this, but he like he, the mom is mortal. And Zeus is the dead Sahara. I think, you know, in classic Hera fashion being pissed at her, her philandering husband.
Misha 30:17
They didn't talk about that at all. They went, they went
Tyler 30:20
off script for sure. But hair. Yeah. So you know, the the, the famous, like, 12 labors of Hercules, right. Like the famous things yesterday.
Misha 30:29
So yeah, but you know, not all of our listeners might know, I definitely know it. So,
Tyler 30:34
one, one version of the myth. I mean, like the 12 labors are like the most famous thing a Hercules did. But one version is like he's so filled with guilt. After murdering Megan, like their nine children, that he goes to the Oracle of Delphi who's working for Hera. And the Oracle says, hey, you need to go work for your archrival. And Do whatever he tells you. So for the next 10 years, or whatever hair please does. impossible task after impossible task. And a lot of those are shown in montages in the movie actually, like defeating the Navy and lion defeating airmen Theon bore defeating the Hydra blah, blah, blah. But others say that the
Misha 31:11
by the way, like familia side is like, so common. I mean, not so common, but like it happens where like, Dad, I'll just be like, I lost my shirt and then kill his whole family. Yeah, yeah. It's a thing that happens and imagine having God powers and human idiocy. Yeah. I mean,
Tyler 31:35
he's basically like, yeah, like a roided out. football player, basically, who like just super strength with a pea brain. And no social skills, because like, who taught like his parents tried to teach him but he was too dumb and awkward. And then he gets all of his lessons from Phil, who's not a good role model. So of course, Hercules is gonna be a piece of shit. Or at least in this movie, I don't actually remember Phil was part of it. And well, it doesn't matter. But yeah, so here's the movie. It sounds like you didn't like the movie.
Misha 32:08
Keep that away.
Tyler 32:11
Well, let's get into it. Originality. Does it get any points for originality? Like, does it get any points for telling a completely wrong story about our Achilles?
Misha 32:23
No. Okay. No. And, and we'll get more into why it's not original. As we go through the categories. Okay. Great.
Tyler 32:35
So, yeah, then let's keep moving on for originally. I'm fine with that. Story.
Misha 32:40
We might have differing opinions. I don't know. I want to know what you think. I think everybody knows from my retelling what I think of this Yeah, story.
Tyler 32:50
I think so. Full disclosure. I like this movie. A lot. But it's got it's got some problems, but I can't It's like a It's it's a weird. It's like a weird late 90s nostalgic mess. Like I it just brings back fond memories watching this movie, which is one reason I like it. Also, it's just like,
Misha 33:12
this is supposed to be an objective score. No,
Tyler 33:15
I know. I'm
Misha 33:16
not. It's not It's me is not
Tyler 33:19
a score.
Misha 33:20
Teenage Tyler wanting to stick it in whatever. It's
Tyler 33:24
not affecting the score. Don't worry, I'm a scientist. I'm just saying like, I liked it. I liked the movie for different reasons. histology watching it with my brothers and my younger sister. While you know, we were at home on Disney Channel, like over and over and over again. I also like it because I just think it's like a fun stupid mess. But story wise, I think the story is pretty bad. Like it's it's disjointed. It's the pacing is really bad. The end is way too abrupt. Really. The beginning is way too long and bloated and boring. The man like he doesn't actually become a hero. Like not hero in the true sense of it. Like this movie is trying to tell us but a hero isn't like he's a commercialized famous monster beater. He does monster beater.
Misha 34:10
He doesn't get everyone's a monster beater and his victory movie.
Tyler 34:13
Like he doesn't beat the hydrogel. 45 minutes in or something. So it's just it takes a long time for this movie to get go. Beginning
Misha 34:19
was very long, and I didn't understand why I was like thinking, okay, maybe it'll make sense later. Like, why this is so drawn out and it doesn't the parts that they should have drawn out were rushed, and I don't I don't even get why.
Tyler 34:36
Yeah, it's weird. Like the whole movie hinges on why Hercules feels like he needs to become a hero. And that part was really rushed. And it's also just kind of weak, like, Oh, get to Olympus. Like that's a really bad motivation. I don't know. Like, yeah, poor parents that took care of this asshole for years. And yeah, he's
Misha 34:55
like, Fuck you by and they're like, um, we miss. We're gonna miss you and you Like,
Tyler 35:00
the parents are also like, Look, son, you're ruining our lives. We here's the truth, and
Misha 35:06
maybe go deal with it really nice about it, though.
Tyler 35:09
I know but it is kind of funny to those jerks and I'm like, where Wayne Knight was right. It was Newman. Did you know? No. Or Nidri? If you're a wrestler, thank
Misha 35:24
you. Yep. Oh, Dennis Nidri. Right. Nidri
Tyler 35:28
Very good. ecovia Calavera that is surgery.
Misha 35:34
His name is Nidri Wait, what?
Tyler 35:37
Surgery? Nedry I think it's natural. I don't Okay, can be either. I don't know. It just You just seem to put some a lot of flavor on it. Anyway,
Misha 35:47
I'm told that I speak Polish with an Italian accent. So that's
Tyler 35:52
beautiful.
Misha 35:53
Thank you. copier paper? Zhaohua.
Tyler 35:57
Oh, yes, indeed you do. No, I don't. But it sounded Italian.
Misha 36:04
If we have any polish speaking or hearing listeners, send us an email with what you think I just said.
Tyler 36:16
will be fun. Yeah, I mean, I don't know. The story stinks. I, I will save I'll save my I like this movie for other categories. And for the final lessons. But yeah, a fun fact. But like, the story is that the reason this story
Misha 36:28
sucks. I was so disappointed. The
Tyler 36:34
only part of the story that I think is interesting is like when we can get into this but the Haiti side of it like Hades, like yes, he's wanting to take over is
Misha 36:45
cool. And they should have just taken out less of Hercules and made Hades the protagonist. Okay, maybe not the protagonist, because it'd be the villain. Yep. But like focusing on the villain, because he was animated well, and he was kind of cool. And he was fun. And his motive was way better than whatever the fuck Hercules was up to? Yeah. Total dominion over everything. Yeah, that's, I can understand that. I don't understand what Hercules wanted. Yeah,
Tyler 37:23
it's, I mean, it's really, really wishy washy. It's like Hercules wants to fit in. And then Hercules wants doesn't
Misha 37:29
know. But he's like, he immediately he's like, I don't want to fit in. Because I try and I'm bad at it. And like, my, you know, my feelings are being hurt. And so now I have to totally do something else.
Tyler 37:42
I want to know, I want to know how, like how I can belong. Okay,
Misha 37:46
actually, feeling wanting to belong is legitimate, but they did not. It's very important do a good job of conveying those feelings. It was more just like, I suck. It's like, yeah.
Tyler 38:02
Yeah. And he's like, I want to I don't fit in I want to belong, and then they're like, son, you're a god. And he's like, oh, okay, I'm a special I'm a special person. So it's like it kind of any possible like, interesting parts of like Hercules dealing with doubt and like self belief, and like, his place in the community is undercut by like, this, like, short railroad track like railroading to. How do I get to where I'm at as a god? Like, I must, I'm special. And I don't know if that's a good that's not a great message. But I mean, it's fun for a stupid movie, but I suppose but it's not a great message to be like, how are you supposed to belong? Well, you're special. And not supposed to belong? You were more special than others. Yeah, that's not a great that's not special, but not special enough. Yeah, you got weird legs. And you look like Jonah Hill. Like disgusting nipples. They're just weird spirals. The aren't we? Okay, we gotta move on. Like the
Misha 39:03
category so can we just give the story a one because of how? Wow, okay, maybe this goes for doesn't sit right. Whatever. That's just, well, what is what do you think the story should be? It
Tyler 39:14
might be too I think one is too harsh. I think one is a bit too harsh. I don't think it's a great story, but I don't think it's a I don't think it's one bad. I think I think you're letting your passions and emotions dictate your decisions. Wow. So it's never it's never a scientific of you.
Misha 39:28
I'll show you my emotions dictating my decisions.
Tyler 39:34
I don't know like, in my head I'm thinking like a three or four but I
Misha 39:39
don't know it's just people and Gods being pervert and selfish and there's nothing genuine about any of it. And I really, I don't know, it's like zero connection with anybody. I don't know I just it to me it felt really flat.
Tyler 39:59
Okay, so So I have a we meet in the middle like if we if you want to give it a one and I want to give it a four we give it like a two or three
Misha 40:07
just okay the story is that this God becomes mostly mortal Hmm He is predicted to take to stop Hades from taking over and he does
Tyler 40:23
that's pretty cool we're just and that's simple way of looking at that's there's nothing wrong with that
Misha 40:29
okay fine I'll go up to it I'll go up two or three more but we needed more Haiti's I don't know them together like for
Tyler 40:37
sure. Just that I think it's it's the problem with a lot of movies were like the Will you saw this with Aladdin to at least in my opinion, the hero's not interesting. Like the hero is the straight the straight man everybody plays off of like, Meg is I mean, we can get into this but I think Meg is way more interesting have a character. Phil is even like more colorful, even though he's awful. But he's got more like layers to him. Like he's got like
Misha 41:01
speaking of Aladdin. Yeah. Same directors. Yep. Well, you know their whole story here. Yeah, very much during it. I kept saying like, I feel like I'm just watching a Greek version of Aladdin like so many scenes felt identical. Yeah, I think that in and that really bothers me. It's a little design new.
Tyler 41:22
Well, the story behind that is without going too deep into the development thing is they are the people that eventually made Treasure Planet that they that was their that was their that's what they really wanted to do their passion project and Katzenberg kept saying, now do this do this. And they made little mermaid it crushed. They made Aladdin a crusher made it rushed. They made Little Mermaid, and they made a little mermaid and they're like, Okay, now can we make our passion project and catsburg is like that make me another hit. They made Aladdin. And then they're like, Can Can we do it now? And then he's like, No, it's still a stupid idea. Make another hit. And then they're like, Okay. And but Katzenberg was like, one more hit, and then you can make your stupid movie, which I'm not going to support they made this car so they were like, Okay, let's make the most Yeah, they made this movie is sort of by design. Like, let's make the biggest blockbuster we can. It's
Misha 42:12
so shitty when people do that. Sure. I think it hurts the story perverts.
Tyler 42:17
It hurts the story for sure. But I don't hurt the story. It. I mean, yeah, the perverts. I mean, Greek mythology is filled with perverts. So like, that's not
Misha 42:25
I know that. That's why I'm surprised. Okay. I know. Okay, the story of everybody is either somebody was murdered or somebody was fucked, right. I get it or something. Okay, I get it. But if you're making a Disney Kids version, you can do some weird animation stuff. We'll get into that next. But like, just have a zero perverts. Hmm. I don't know. I mean, I think
Tyler 42:57
I think having perverts is fine. The problem is,
Misha 43:00
Tyler, thank
Tyler 43:01
you. Yeah, like that I'm coming finish because I feel like you need to have slimy characters to have like as part of the morality play. Okay. Timeout.
Misha 43:16
You're saying the only way to make somebody slimy is to make them a pervert. No,
Tyler 43:21
but you can have different layers of different types of characters and like having a
Misha 43:25
It was insane. How much of this movie was somebody being a sexual predator?
Tyler 43:32
I agree with that. I totally agree with that a sexual harasser in some cases. Yeah, for sure. No, I I'm not. I'm not like defending those actions. I'm just, I'm just saying like, yeah, there
Misha 43:44
was some of the good guys supposedly, according to maybe whoever wrote this. Like, isn't Phil supposed to be on sort of the good side of things?
Tyler 43:57
Yeah, I would say it was
Misha 43:58
like disheartened and disillusioned and cranky. But he's still like, supposed to be good in quotes. Yeah. Why he's the biggest pervert of them all. Yeah, just make Hades slimy, which he was and he was like, Hey, babe, sweetheart, whatever, like being misogynistic. Fine. That's like the most you should do. Not a Seder masturbating in the bushes.
Tyler 44:24
While sure I will say that went too far. I'm not defending I'm not defending the character Phil.
Misha 44:30
You can hate them for just wanting to murder people. Other different motivations. Oh, god, okay.
Tyler 44:38
Like Jafar
Misha 44:42
we by the way, that last point because he didn't have to be a perv. Yeah.
Tyler 44:48
I mean, this is this is probably like, this is like doesn't say well, I don't know maybe it is story. I feel like it's also like hitting doesn't sit right but
Misha 44:56
it so it does hit doesn't say it right. But there was so much of it throughout the entire movie, and the whole thing was so sexualized the whole thing, every part of it that it's like intertwined with the story like it becomes part of the story is that everyone's horny and a pervert. And so that's how things move along. Anyway, yeah, I'm
Tyler 45:20
not I'm not like we can keep it as disagreeing with that. But I think like, yeah, I don't know. I mean, I guess I'm sick of defending it. I can't I don't have an explanation for why I think three is better. I don't know how I got it. Well, but okay, but like, compared to like, the story of Doug, or the story of like, some of these other movies. This is not a one this this is like a this has a story structure, beginning, middle and end with a climax and denouement, and all these things like
Misha 45:49
Greek mythology, and actually, I like Greek mythology, even the pervy parts, but it's not a Disney kids movie. It's like whatever it is. Anyway, let's get to animation.
Tyler 46:04
Yeah, three for story. Let's move to animation. I mean, parts of it. I liked parts what I didn't. That's kind of the story with a lot of these 90s movies like parts of it are like, very well done. Parts of it are very sloppy, like we're hands on people's shoulders almost always looked bad. And at one point, Hades is like we're resting an arm on Hercules or like resting it, and it just looks really bad. And whenever like Meg is like cuddling up to Hercules. Her hair does weird things. But yeah, it's
Misha 46:39
because they couldn't figure out how to make the weird animation style move the way humans move.
Tyler 46:49
I liked that. They went crazy was Oh style. They went stylized. And part of me likes that. But then like, it looks really wonky. Yep. So
Misha 46:58
yeah. Also, the whole teen part was just disgusting. Yeah, no one was done. Well, it was not executed. Well, it was bad ideas. Like start to finish. Not good.
Tyler 47:13
I think baby Hercules was cute. I think Pegasus is. Oh, no,
Misha 47:18
no, no, no, that was like my first thing. I was like, ah, baby Hercules is
Tyler 47:23
gross. And basically this looks like a little Arnold Schwarzenegger. Oh.
Misha 47:28
Oh, God. Also, what was it the who did Hercules fight? That was CGI Hydra. That was the Hydra. Yep. Why was that the only CGI part of the movie?
Tyler 47:44
I don't know. I mean, we
Misha 47:46
might have been bizarre.
Tyler 47:48
It did look off putting because it stood out. Yeah, I mean, but actually, honestly, compared to compared to some other old CGI, it didn't look as bad as I was expecting it to look, it just was jarring because it was somebody
Misha 47:59
who's never seen the movie before.
Tyler 48:02
Right? It was not good. Didn't think it was good. It just Yeah, maybe.
Misha 48:08
Because it was the first time like the movie. It was like an hour and 20 minutes in or whatever it was. And all of a sudden, there's like something that is totally different from everything else we've seen. And there are other monsters so it's not like, okay, all the monsters are going to be like this. It was just that one that was really out of place. Yeah,
Tyler 48:30
I'm not sure why they ended up doing it. I mean, the 90s were weird. They're like, oh, let's try computers. It's remember that scene in Aladdin where it suddenly goes. Yeah. And it looks really bad. And it's bad. And it lost points for that. I think this is similar. Yeah. But I think the hijab lighter than that
Misha 48:47
Aladdin part. But still at the end, when Hercules is winning and he like, Who does he throw he throws Hades. Right? That like back to the underworld into the pool? Yeah. Yeah. It's like slow motion all of a sudden, but it's animation. Oh,
Tyler 49:03
that was a key throws the Titans out into space. Yeah. And it does this weird, like, slow motion blur for some strange reason. Yeah, there's some weird weird animation. Never
Misha 49:14
seen that before in the movie. Yeah.
Tyler 49:18
I don't like the swirly ear lobes and swirly nipples. Yeah, I hate that. And the swirly the toenails and fingernails were
Misha 49:29
That's really gross. Yeah.
Tyler 49:32
But parts of the like the the look of the the look of grease in the background I thought was nice because it's like that to a stylized letter. If it's stationary, like you said, like not a character who has to move. Yeah.
Misha 49:45
Yeah. Did you notice that? When he was like, famous and having his a vase made to look like him he was wearing a scarf from Lion King suit. Okay,
Tyler 50:00
I did. Yep. When I was a kid, I did not notice it. And then when I heard about it, or like it was pointed out to me, it's so obvious now. Like, it's just super obvious. Yeah, yeah.
Misha 50:10
I didn't notice anything. Oh, that's good, because it's a different animation style.
Tyler 50:14
And like, yeah, it's
Misha 50:15
everything else. You're like, like, I don't know, it just seemed like, so much of it felt like Aladdin. I couldn't I think what I don't like with and with story and animation put together I never I felt confused the whole time. Like, in what way? Like it just like there was a lot of different things like, I don't know, like the gospel singers have a different vibe from everything else. And the pacing was off, and the animation was clunky. So I'm just I never felt like I got into it.
Tyler 51:02
For those who haven't seen the movie when she says gospel singers there are these muses that are like the narrator's or
Misha 51:07
an actual gospel choir that they hired to, like, do gospels style music to narrate the movie and certain parts. But I don't know, I was just sitting there kind of like, not getting into it at all. Just sort of like, okay, okay, now this is happening. Okay, now this looks like this. Okay, now this is happening. And the animation was weird. The pacing has a lot to do with it. I just felt like I never connected with what I was watching. And for
Tyler 51:48
me, I kind of have a different a bit. I mean, I agree about the story thing we talked about already like, but I think the disjointedness of it, like from a wackiness style is nice, because I don't know, it's like a weird 90s moment of like, okay, so with Romeo and Juliet, we've shipped on it for all of its pop culture references. Because they're like really insisting upon themselves. And they're really like, they did a lot. They do a lot, too. But it's like, there's something different to me, there's something different about the way they did it in this, like, it's part of like the whole like vibe of the movie, but that might just because it's like so 90s I don't know, maybe I'm being too biased in one direction.
Misha 52:32
There were things about the animation. I really did like, like we talked about Hades, I liked the whole underworld scenes. I liked the backgrounds. There were things that I really liked. But there were Yeah, just I guess, a few mess ups, including Hercules and Meg. And
Tyler 52:52
yeah, I think I think if you're going to have a movie, like I mean, I said something similar about Aladdin and Jasmine, if you're going to have a movie, you gotta get the main characters, right. And if the main character Yeah, looks kind of badly drawn, sometimes it's really off. But I think Meg makes like, she's made to look like sort of like, she's very stylized and looks like a Greek amphora on purpose. That's cool looking. I think she looks interesting. But then like you said, she starts moving, and it all gets really weird really fast. Like her hair. She moves her head side to side for hair. Doesn't work, basically. So yeah, I don't know. I mean, like, right,
Misha 53:30
like they knew how to make. They knew how to make illustrations, but they weren't sure how to animate
Tyler 53:37
- And I mean, and I mean, animated enemy. I don't know. Like, I feel like somewhere in the I feel like, the high points are good. And then there's some really low points and then there's like a lot of Middle East Middle High
Misha 53:55
points or like, just good. Like, not great.
Tyler 54:00
Not like good cocoa or something like that. For sure.
Misha 54:04
Right. I think on the low end of okay. I would give it a I mean, see, the thing is, I think the animation is a lot better than story and we gave story three and I want to give animation a four but I don't think it's only one point better. I think it's two points better but I don't think it deserves a five because it messes up a lot.
Tyler 54:25
I do think like the I do think for the most part like the animation is okay enough to like, cover its blushes though or whatever the phrase may be I think a five I mean to me personally, I think like a five works. If I do love the witches, which is a cool I mean the whole underworld is great. The river sticks with all the like, yeah, the spirits floating in it. The callbacks to Fantasia like there are a couple callbacks a Fantasia out there. We're good, me. Yeah. All right.
Misha 54:54
I'll give it a five middle of the road because yeah,
Tyler 54:57
that is taking a bunch of points off for the wonkiness. If at all so I mean that's a for works too.
Misha 55:02
I mean, I could be persuaded to go to but I think it's I think the animation is not just one point better than story. I think I mean, you know my opinion on the story so how about this? How
Tyler 55:13
about we move a story for animation? Okay. Oh,
Misha 55:17
I was gonna say move story to add to to give animation a four. Yeah. Yeah. If you want um, I don't Mike Taylor. I do not mind for your on this movie.
Tyler 55:29
I don't have like a strong negative opinions of adults. I'm fine with like, shitting I mean, I feel like I'm maybe too close to this one.
Misha 55:37
Okay, wait, enemies. Yes, we're doing this and I'll tell you why. That fucking Cyclops was the most disgusting thing. What? Nessus Oh,
Tyler 55:46
that's the center. What is the center of center? Yeah, the at the end? No, that's a cycle. That's a cyclops. Nessus check out the Cyclops. No, yes. This is something different. Oh, sure. Okay, the Cyclops at the yes, this is the the the Centaur with a penis for a head who tries to that's wait for things again. But now they've got the guy in the middle. The blue guy who's got Megwin make first mix. I have to look at this. I'm getting really mixed. Cyclops is at the end with there's a literal penis on his head. The center nurses.
Misha 56:22
Oh, right. Right Way, Way. Way. Way. Way, way way.
Tyler 56:26
Is also gross, but he's I'm sorry. I'm
Misha 56:28
getting mixed up nurses is so gross. Yes, the Centaur it right. Why did they animate him like that at all? I couldn't understand. I have to post this to social media.
Tyler 56:44
And then also then, yeah, he gets hit in the head and why bruise? I know
Misha 56:50
when I understand. Yeah, a welt. Well,
Tyler 56:54
that's it. Thank you. And it looks like a penis because
Misha 56:57
his forehead. Yeah. Okay, so he has a cleft forehead, which is not a thing. But they did this joke. I think that these fucking perverts who made this movie, I want to give ones across the board. They made his head his forehead to look like testicles. So then when he got hit in the head, a penis grew. And I really think that's like, but the rest of him is ugly, too. Why did they make him with like, yeah, he's really good. Like,
Tyler 57:29
he's got this stringy weird, like riffraff hair. And he's got
Misha 57:33
little hairs on his nose. And he's got points.
Tyler 57:37
I would argue that his head looks like Yeah, his head looks like a winner I think but then when he grows the well it turns into a winner
Misha 57:45
and saying no, I think is head Oh, Taylor. I hate you so much.
Tyler 57:56
It's it's another layer of gross. Yeah. And he's got the Jim Cummings voice like he sounds like rasool and Tigger and Winnie the Pooh and it's it's all bad. Yeah, that's Chris the Cyclops at the end however, I he is gross but I think it works. He looks cool. Like with his weird teeth,
Misha 58:12
he was fine until he was bouncing Hercules off of his butt.
Tyler 58:17
Yeah, he was using for us keep akinola.
Misha 58:22
Yeah, no, no okay. That's isn't on your but it's on your feet
Tyler 58:29
does hit him off his knees a couple of times. That's why I said it like that but
Misha 58:33
and yeah, but and his with his thigh
Tyler 58:38
drops his play sock there's too much might be different rules. There might be a lot of butts involved.
Misha 58:43
I hate you. Okay, we're changing so for this fine uh, for I would honestly just give this a one
Tyler 58:52
story to animation for I mean yeah, like I was about to say like I'm think I'm too close to this one. I have fond memories and like, I think this movie is dumb, but I also like it so I might be being too generous. I don't know trying to find trying to find so we need to cut your time. Yeah, cuz we might I might be trying to find like nice things
Tyler 59:20
that's the hashtag. Alright, moving on. Music. Music I think is one of the worst movies
Misha 59:28
Okay, good. I was like I swear to God, like quitting this show.
Tyler 59:33
No, I think though, the only highlight the only thing the only like, bright spot I can think of the music is very, like, functional and bland. But functional. Yes.
Misha 59:44
Yes. Function mediocre. Mediocre fine blend.
Tyler 59:49
Yeah, the only bright spot I can think of is they what they do nicely in it is they weave the theme like the the Go the Distance theme. They weave didn't have the score throughout the whole movie whenever there's like a heroic I think that's a nice touch. But the song go the distance is dumb, I think. Yeah, it's not but I think the the muses are cool. And I think Meg song is really like the music Meg song is really great. And I think it does like affect the score positively. I hated her song when I was younger. Great think it's a really great song really
Misha 1:00:23
great, really great song.
Tyler 1:00:25
It does it. It's it does its job perfectly of like, like selling who she is as a character and what she cares about. And like, what she who like, who she is, like in a classic sort of like I want type way. Like I'm done with love. Fuck love. I hate it. But this symbol is really cute. But I can't do this again. I think it does every well also, just stylistically. I think it's like nice. It sounds nice.
Misha 1:00:51
It's got a good stylistic sound. Yes. I did not like the lyrics but I liked the sound of it.
Tyler 1:00:59
I think it's what Yeah, I don't know. I mean, this is me. I don't know this. I'm a dude. So I don't have a good frame of reference. But I think the the feeling of like, not a dead feeling is super relatable like not wanting to fall into a trap again, but you are saying that while you're falling into that trap, that's like super help the heart can't help it can help the the that just the heart but the the winners and the loins, you gotta grid those other private grid loads.
Misha 1:01:28
Yeah, yeah, I get it. It's I
Tyler 1:01:30
mean, we can get into this later. I think we're gonna have a fight about this, but I really love Meg, but Well, we can get into that. Does I think the movie really does or does or dirty? Not sure if that sigh But but I think she's really great. Anyway, we can get into that, that the rest of the music, whatever. Not not so great, mediocre at best. But I think that song does push it up. And I think the muses are a nice touch inspired and
Misha 1:01:58
I liked the music, that muses because the music's I liked the Muses, because it's, it felt so different from other like, I liked how it was kind of different from other Disney movies or just like, hey, this is hap like, I don't know, it was really fun. And they're really good. Yeah, like quality singers. They're excellent. And the songs were fun, too. So I liked the music. They just reused some of the score from Aladdin. I know they did
Tyler 1:02:30
it sound similar, but it's not the same.
Misha 1:02:34
Okay, it's the same composer. So he just did that and was like, oh, I'll just use bail cheap music because I'm being forced to do this. And I'll just tweak it a little boy,
Tyler 1:02:44
that's cheating. I don't none of that happened. But sure. I mean, if that happened, yes.
Misha 1:02:48
All right. Is what happened.
Tyler 1:02:50
Do you have evidence?
Misha 1:02:52
I called him up.
Tyler 1:02:53
Yeah. All right. Called up to get them on the phone.
Misha 1:02:59
Again,
Tyler 1:03:00
you're gonna, you're gonna, you're going to accuse Mankin of of phoning it in,
Misha 1:03:05
hold on. I'm calling in right now. Ready? Hello, says Alan. I just reused. Yeah, those add Wow.
Tyler 1:03:24
Wow. Told
Misha 1:03:27
you told Yeah. I
Tyler 1:03:29
feel like that's, I mean, I was gonna say that feel like that's really unfair. But you just heard it. He was on the phone. So I guess I'm wrong. Humble. Allen's mouth train from Lincoln.
Misha 1:03:42
Straight from the Mankins mouth.
Tyler 1:03:44
I get back to the Muse thing. That's one thing when I was trying to like explain that the the weird disjointedness of this movie is fun to me. That's what I'm talking about. Like the Muses come in. And they do something. There's like weird montages that are kind of wacky and don't really, it could not be ancient Greece. It could be like, it could be goof true. You know, like, with the other credit card and weird stuff. And anyway. Yeah, I don't know.
Misha 1:04:10
Can we talk about Danny DeVito singing
Tyler 1:04:15
it does hurt the score. Yeah,
Misha 1:04:17
yeah, it sure does. Bad. Why didn't they get someone else to sing that song? Who can do a Danny DeVito kind of impersonation?
Tyler 1:04:27
I don't know. Because they do that all the time. Like they have the for example, Hercules has a voice and then a singing voice like why don't they just do that with Danny DeVito didn't
Misha 1:04:36
I get sometimes you want the person to do it but this
Tyler 1:04:39
was bad really bad. Yeah, luckily it was short. Yeah, still hurts the score still hurts the score.
Misha 1:04:47
All right, Tyler. I weren't strong army on this one.
Tyler 1:04:51
I think most like so the score. Not the score like our score, but the score sound Risk Score is mediocre. It's not original It sounds similar to Aladdin. So that mediocre at best all with the weaving of the theme like I mentioned maybe makes it a little bit better than mediocre. The Phil song brings it down. The muses bring it up. Meg brings it up the Go the Distance Michael Bolton song brings it down. I think in my opinion, a lot of people will love that this song, by the way, but I really hate it. Yeah, it was like, it was a I could be misremembering, but I feel like it was a big hit back then. On like, adult contemporary, like in dentists office. It's very dentist office. I don't know, I think like a four. Somewhere around for Region. Okay,
Misha 1:05:48
for it is. All right. Next up. protagonist.
Tyler 1:05:55
protagonists they go, Hercules?
Misha 1:05:57
Big old.
Tyler 1:06:00
Like I said before him bow. I don't know, too. He's really bad. There's not much likable about him. He's really dumb. He's really.
Misha 1:06:11
He's really.
Tyler 1:06:12
He's really not interesting. Yeah. Doesn't do anything interesting. Like there's nothing really to root for with him either. Yeah, that one? I don't.
Misha 1:06:23
I would go for a one.
Tyler 1:06:26
Yeah, I mean, you just, you just were generous in the music category. For my sake. I mean, but to be fair, I was generous to you first to the animation store. But anyway, if we're really going to keep track here, but if you I will let you take the lead. What do you think we should do? Hercules? Okay,
Misha 1:06:42
I'm looking at old movies. And I'm kind of upset that DuckTales got a one for protagonists, and I know Scrooge is a capitalist asshole. And he's a jerk throughout the movie. But any day, I will choose Scrooge McDuck over Hercules Scrooge has any.
Tyler 1:07:00
I mean, the thing is Scrooge has that charisma. He's a corrupt charismatic guy.
Misha 1:07:04
Why did we do what what I know why we did it. Why? Because he's a monster. And he is a monster. And He's greedy. And he's mean to everybody. Including, what's her name? webby. No, yeah.
Tyler 1:07:16
No. shabooey No. She
Misha 1:07:21
didn't his nice webby.
Tyler 1:07:23
I think webby Yeah,
Misha 1:07:24
she's so cute and sweet. And he's a jerk. I get it. Hercules. I want to just
Tyler 1:07:31
there ones for different reasons. You know, he's a one because you know,
Misha 1:07:35
I know I'm just thinking like, are we comparing it to Lightning McQueen is better than Hercules Lightning
Tyler 1:07:42
McQueen is a more interesting protagonist. Yeah, it hurts me deep inside to say that but it's true like he's got a bigger a better and we do we did score it in cars three accordingly. Like his arc,
Misha 1:07:55
he does have a much better he does really well for the cars. You know,
Tyler 1:07:59
he does have three movies to get through it. Whereas this movie wasn't gonna be
Misha 1:08:03
that's how they made his character. There were like, not a single movie arc but like the arc over three movies and then they started making cars one so maybe we just have to wait for Hercules two and three.
Tyler 1:08:18
I can't I mean, I can't think that they I started thinking cars too was gonna happen
Misha 1:08:24
if they come out with more Hercules is I'm not well, there
Tyler 1:08:28
was there was no there was a direct to direct to God DVD or whatever.
Misha 1:08:33
We'll have to do that in season two or whatever. But there
Tyler 1:08:37
was a plan but they it didn't do very well.
Misha 1:08:42
As if I liked it
Tyler 1:08:47
this weird like revisionist history about cars is not good. It's not healthy. No, but I
Misha 1:08:53
did erase Mater from the cars universe and it helps a lot. Yeah, I
Tyler 1:09:01
I haven't been able to get to that step.
Misha 1:09:03
I'm good. It just, it's, you know, out of sight out of mind. I think I'm thinking about Michael Caine. I'm thinking about spy movies. I like that. That's it. That's all. Hercules gets a one. He sucks.
Tyler 1:09:18
arquus gets a one. He sucks. Yeah. Okay, side kicks.
Misha 1:09:22
Is it failed? Because then like, maybe get it too. So Phil can get a one. Well,
Tyler 1:09:30
no, I think once for different reasons.
Misha 1:09:32
But I know I'm joking. I'm not getting Yeah. And Pegasus.
Tyler 1:09:38
Pegasus is involved too. Yeah,
Misha 1:09:40
I was a jerk and I don't know why. Pegasus
Tyler 1:09:44
just doesn't like mag. Yeah, he does it because he's,
Misha 1:09:48
like, they don't make portray Pegasus is like, knowing that Meg is shady. He's just like, possesses Hercules.
Tyler 1:09:59
He's just possessive.
Misha 1:10:01
Nice quality.
Tyler 1:10:02
No, it's not. It's like It's like the bros before hos thing that people say it's like yeah, bro. We were supposed to like go to a kegger and instead you're watching friends with your girlfriend. What the fuck dude?
Misha 1:10:14
Come on
Tyler 1:10:17
that's Pegasus voice in the studio.
Misha 1:10:22
And then they just change it to
Tyler 1:10:24
Yeah. Yeah he's gross Phil I mean he's not gross. He's as bad I think he's toxic and Phil is very toys
Misha 1:10:33
in the doesn't sit right category this gets a one Yeah, I it makes it look a little more bearable. Yeah,
Tyler 1:10:46
because again, it's like that straight man against like the weird wacky is like, but
Misha 1:10:50
they're not wearing black. Just jerks and perverts.
Tyler 1:10:53
I mean, like,
Misha 1:10:55
I know what you're saying. It's a category like the characters with your the formula that they just formulas?
Tyler 1:11:02
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Also, like Pegasus is just underdeveloped. Just like he's not really in it. He's like, he's not. He's not even like, like, carpet is barely in Aladdin, but carpet instantly brings her personality and
Misha 1:11:16
charming carpet is really great. Yeah. I love carpet.
Tyler 1:11:20
Oh, yeah. I guess this is like a like a bad carpet.
Misha 1:11:25
Yeah, not nice.
Tyler 1:11:27
I want one part I do like about Pegasus is when they're sleeping when they're babies. And he does the Yeah.
Misha 1:11:33
Oh, Steven. I like yeah, Stephen. I like you. Oh, boo boo boo boo boo boo. Yeah.
Tyler 1:11:39
It's so cute.
Misha 1:11:40
Very cute. Um, that's one of my favorite cartoon things like Donald Duck era, like 40s 50s. Like, yeah, one they get a how
Tyler 1:11:51
many This hurts because I really still deeply like this movie in a weird toxic way. Probably unhealthy. Like of this movie, but
Misha 1:11:59
Okay, we're gonna get to some good parts next and let's move all right. Now this is where I think it does. Okay. Villain. Okay. villain is okay. Like that.
Tyler 1:12:12
I was trying to, I don't know, court controversy.
Misha 1:12:15
Okay, there's enough where you're like, really? The products are great.
Tyler 1:12:21
perverts rule the world.
Misha 1:12:24
The problem? Yeah,
Tyler 1:12:26
there's a lot. It's not even funny. I'm
Misha 1:12:29
so bad at this movie.
Tyler 1:12:33
Hades is really great. Hey, yes, similar, another sort of callback to like Aladdin. But similar to the genie. They had to like, they had to like really work on his animation to catch up with the performer, which is
Misha 1:12:48
who was doing the animation was cool his character other than Him being like misogynistic. Which, yeah. But he's a villain. And we did. He did. Like, you know. Jafar lost points for that. But he was very cool. And his animation was cool. And when he would get angry, like in a flash, and he turned red, and his eyes would go crazy. Like, his motivation was kind of clear. And just like, Yes, this is what I'm trying to do. And I will do like, I liked it. I thought it was great.
Tyler 1:13:23
I liked it a lot. Yeah, I and it's also very fun when there's a villain who's very scary and very powerful, but very bad at being like
Misha 1:13:34
gambling, goofiness. Yeah, totally. And then it gets scary.
Tyler 1:13:37
I mean, yeah, it gets scary very quickly, and like very manipulative and smart. But then also, like, keep sending idiot things after Hercules that won't work and also just falls into the classic sort of, like, Greek tragedy trap of like, self fulfilling prophecy. Like oh, Hercules is my one weakness. Let me engage him and fight.
Misha 1:14:01
Exactly.
Tyler 1:14:03
So classic.
Misha 1:14:04
Yeah, this classic and I liked that. I liked that idea of like, don't use like, knowing the future is dangerous. Like I like that. Yeah.
Tyler 1:14:15
Yeah, I think I mean, he's, he's like the super bright spot for sure.
Misha 1:14:19
Yeah. What would you say?
Tyler 1:14:21
I think I think he's like a mine is really good. Okay,
Misha 1:14:25
I was gonna say an eight but I think we should take a point off. So I was gonna say an eight was very generous. Yes. But like he I thought he was great every time he said something to Meg. Like that's like crossing a line and not just being a creep like a scary villain but like, just like predator Yeah, and I
Tyler 1:14:53
make that's fine. Yeah. Yeah, I think it doesn't seem doesn't sit right.
Misha 1:14:58
I think it is, but like There's so much that doesn't sit right that I think he his character also needs to lose that. Sure.
Tyler 1:15:06
Yeah, that's the same reasons. No, yeah, we just totally dunked on Phil's score for the same thing. So yeah, he should not be safe from that for sure.
Misha 1:15:16
Yeah. I got an eight okay seven down to is Are you okay with a seven?
Tyler 1:15:21
Sevens fine? Yeah, I was I would say like a nine because he's like,
Misha 1:15:25
she is Cinderella stepmothers a nine and I think she's better than Hades.
Tyler 1:15:30
Well, I was gonna say he's like, an Yeah, I was just saying nine but then those things bring them down to an eight but but I see what you mean. Yeah, the the wicked
Misha 1:15:40
scarier villain. He's an eight and he I think He's way better.
Tyler 1:15:44
Okay, seven marks. Yeah.
Misha 1:15:46
Okay. Yeah.
Tyler 1:15:48
I like Hades better than hopper. But I think hopper is a better like zealot, maybe. Oh, that's, that's debatable. That's something to think about.
Misha 1:15:56
I think hopper is a better villain, because I think he's a lot scarier. Yeah,
Tyler 1:16:01
but I guess it's like, but then it depends on what lens you're looking at it from, like, if you're looking at it from like,
Misha 1:16:09
well, if I'm like, big, silly, silly guy, and I keep sending like dumped jobs after to do my job. Like you're gonna lose a point for villain. Unless, yeah, right. It's sort of like, what is our category? How good you are as a villain or how do we like you?
Tyler 1:16:24
Yeah, what is the like? Yeah, because I don't know there are nuances to it like is, are you a good villain? Because you're like scheming a lot. Like Jafar is a schemer, but he's bad at everything. Other villains are like, just scary. Like the man and Bambi is just terrifying. Yeah. Right. Like there's nothing else but just like a sort of cosmic horror. And then like, and hopper is like, kind of, he's not. He's just kind of scary too. But he's got like, bumbling side kicks who write or his crutch, which is kind of similar to Hades, but Hades is just a bit goofier. I like how Hades is like a sleazy sort of used car salesman. Yeah.
Misha 1:17:08
I do too. And like sort of like, right, like, innately powerful. Like he was just given powers, but his personality is like, Whoa, yeah, yeah, I like him.
Tyler 1:17:20
But I think I think a seven is good. Because if you were in our world, he'd be like, he'd be in prison. No, he
Misha 1:17:27
wouldn't. Not in America. Well, he'd be like, I feel like he'd be like been doing quite well here. He'd be like,
Tyler 1:17:35
what's the turnout or whatever like, or like the gymnastics coach? He he wouldn't be in prison I think or before or he'd be President of the United States either.
Misha 1:17:49
Or not. So I like yeah, he bad for me just fine. Ah, yeah.
Tyler 1:17:55
Misha is really anti Biden so forgot to say guys
Misha 1:17:59
I don't think I would say that I'm pro Biden.
Tyler 1:18:04
Who's pro Biden that's what I'm so let's get into it. Okay, so I mean, I I'm anti presidents in general so whatever but we can't that's different
Misha 1:18:12
set. Okay. God Yeah, just like a whole other thing. Honestly, we're Gods just with super powers. Fine. Give them fucking whatever power they want. Whatever system we have here is bullshit. Okay, that's for another day. henchmen. henchmen
Tyler 1:18:33
pain and panic. And maybe the I love which is I was gonna say are the fates involved to know I don't
Misha 1:18:43
wish they were. I would, I would give them a 10 They're cracking awesome. But I don't think they count as henchmen because they're just yeah, they're, they didn't want to help. Hadees and he was like, please, and they're like, Yeah, you're a fucking idiot. Okay, like you asked for it. They gave him the information, and it messed him up. So I love the riches. Because they knew that was gonna happen. They warned him against Yeah. During between life and death, oh, what? Ooh, so good.
Tyler 1:19:18
Oh, chef's kiss.
Misha 1:19:20
Yeah, that is
Tyler 1:19:24
I love pain and panic.
Misha 1:19:26
I like them
Tyler 1:19:27
all. They're great.
Misha 1:19:28
They really they're good henchmen. I think this might be the highest score for this movie. Yeah.
Tyler 1:19:36
They do the that, that sort of, they're nasty and they're not likable, but they're very bumbling and entertaining. They think they're like a needle very well perfectly.
Misha 1:19:47
Yeah. i And like every time they realize that they fucked up and they're getting caught. But like, I don't know. i They were my favorite part of the movie besides the witches one which is yeah to pain and panic.
Tyler 1:20:02
I like how they're shapeshifters. And they like, when they're like the little kids like, gee whiz, mister. That's really great. When they're like the somber like they look like no wait Thumper and that
Misha 1:20:15
horse that think the sexy horse. Oh my god, I was so disturbed by that scene. Okay, so they're trying to trap Pegasus. So pain and panic joined together to form to shape shift into a sexy pink force. That's like, Oh, look at me and Pegasus is like, Oh, yeah. And then they fucking the start was so disturbing. They separate. Pegasus goes insane in a second. Like, oh my god, I just watched a horse split into Yeah, it's like so trippy and so weird. And I like was disturbed and equally amused and enjoyed. Like watching that it was fucking weird. Yeah, so
Tyler 1:21:10
yeah, it's like I don't know it goes back to movies. Yeah, it's a weird like paint by numbers formula movie but with a bunch of zany little things like that that popper like the music isn't that and like Yeah, and
Misha 1:21:23
I liked the idea of like, thinking painted panic we're like oh, we're gonna do something real weird to hear
Tyler 1:21:31
ya do and then it comes back later when when Pegasus catches them like when there's the battle and in the guys are quote unquote good guys are winning Pegasus corners them and Payne says something like, like you got it all wrong. I was attracted to you or something like that. It's just like, I totally missed it. I think it was the first time I clocked it like watching it this time. I was like, That's really funny. I
Misha 1:21:56
do like that you just said quote unquote good guys because like, the way I learned about Greek gods is that no one was good. Yeah, like that. Right? Is that how you learn like the gods are like intentionally fucking with humans? Because they know they can? Yeah, they're just like chaos like agents of chaos. Yeah, it's like they have unlimited power to do so and like barely any repercussions other than getting jealous of each other and then fucking each other up more.
Tyler 1:22:26
Yeah, it's just like different. I mean, yeah, we don't it's a different cause like way of looking at the universe like the God is like a perfect creator. It's a the gods are like, more relevant,
Misha 1:22:38
but benevolent, like nice or out for our well being. They're just there.
Tyler 1:22:43
They're there. They created shit, but they're like they're just as nasty as we are. But just way more powerful
Misha 1:22:48
way. I'm like, I don't understand this movie. Because like we know this. Yeah,
Tyler 1:22:54
everyone knows this is a going chode lick but they tried to turn him into a good father and Hara is insane as well. And then, like some of the cooler ones don't even get like we didn't get no Athena. She's, she's,
Misha 1:23:06
it's just like, so that's the thing. Like, I always thought Greek mythology was like, really cool. And I was kind of disappointed by this. Maybe because Hercules is the most lame of like, all the things I don't know. Just
Tyler 1:23:24
like if you're gonna Yeah, like for me personally like looking back if you're going to make a Disney Greek myth movie about basically about love make it about Orpheus like make it about going to the underworld to like, yeah, get your love you ready to see and go oh, spooky.
Tyler 1:23:42
Spooky make it a little spicy.
Misha 1:23:45
Yeah, I mean, I How many times have I said it on this podcast? I love spooky. I needed to just forget Hercules more spooky. Yeah. Or,
Tyler 1:23:55
I mean even when you try to think of like, a better more interesting here like Odysseus is more interesting, I think. Because his superpower is like his cunning rather than his like super strength or whatever. But he's a total asshole too. So it's and Jason was an asshole like all of them are assholes. So it's like oh, yeah, it's hard to pick a the end that I keep saying he is an asshole. He's an asshole because that's another huge part of it. All these are like fucking roided out toxic masculine masculinity dudes rather than like interesting. Three dimensional characters. But anyway. Okay, yeah. engeman henchmen is? I don't know.
Misha 1:24:31
I think they should get an 809 a nine.
Tyler 1:24:34
I mean, they're they do the henchmen in what I want from henchmen perfectly. They're bad at their job. And they're very earnest.
Misha 1:24:42
I'll give them a nine.
Tyler 1:24:43
I think I think they're
Misha 1:24:45
good for a nine with that. I really like that. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.
Tyler 1:24:51
All right. Boy,
Misha 1:24:52
this is where we might disagree. Maybe
Tyler 1:24:55
not as much as you think so. Okay. So so this is strong for The
Misha 1:25:00
title category. Hmm.
Tyler 1:25:05
I feel like I know what you're gonna say but, but go for it.
Misha 1:25:09
What am I gonna say?
Tyler 1:25:12
She is too focused on like what men think about her and like her life according to what men say and dictate for hers, which makes her not strong.
Misha 1:25:25
That close this kind of close, it's more like, she had the potential to be there as a character, but then the rest of the movie happened. Right? Like the right the story takes away from. It's like, but every. So I was thinking about this because I was like, you know, like, what does a strong woman mean? And it's not like, there isn't one more mold for what a strong woman looks like. Yeah, and there isn't just one tight like, it's not just, it's not, oh, you have to have like male characteristics like stereotypically male qualities. It's not that. But what does bother me is that every part of her story hinges on what a man is doing to her. Yeah. And there's they the, you know, this could be a flaw of the story, and not her per se, that so she's in this predicament because she was in love with this man who did who then treated her badly. Now Hades is treating her badly. Then man comes and rescues her Hercules from Hades, right, like, she does save Hercules and sacrifice herself. And so that I think is worth something. But that sucks. Like her only point where she's showing strength and where she's making decisions for herself is to sacrifice herself for a man. And then at the end, Hercules is going to go with the gods and she's like, Okay, again, I'm being left again. Like, and it's like, not even happy for him that he's a fucking god now. And like, I don't know, like she was brought back from the dead. And that was like, glossed over in her view. Yeah, right. It wasn't like, holy shit. I was crushed to death. I'm alive. Thank you. Like, I have to rethink my life, you know, or whatever. It was just like, hurray, Hercules. You saved me. The end. Oh, you're leaving me? Oh, we're back. You're back. Right? Like, it's so focused off of her. Yeah. Every motivation is not about her. Yeah, she's scorn or she's in love. That's it. And I it's like, kind of ups like, this is where Disney gets it wrong a lot when there's a love interest. And I love when they don't have romantic fit. Like, I love when there's friendships. And it's not necessarily romantic interest, because it's like, this is a person in and of themselves. She's never a person of like, she's never her own person in this. Yeah,
Tyler 1:28:29
I completely agree with all of that. 100% I don't like yeah, I don't buy it. Yeah, my my take his like I said before, I really liked her because I I think she's got I think there's a lot that could have been great about her. And there's a lot to her personality like her. I like that. She's very witty. I like that. She's sarcastic. I like that she's
Misha 1:28:51
like to but it doesn't serve her. No, no,
Tyler 1:28:53
you're totally right.
Misha 1:28:54
I mean, that's what's disappointing. Yeah. Right. Like,
Tyler 1:28:57
I think in like a strong female lead scenario. This is very, very, very low. I just think like, she's an interesting character that could have been better. Yeah.
Misha 1:29:07
I think she's a really interesting character. But what it felt like was like, This is what men think strong women are,
Tyler 1:29:13
of course, yeah, I think that's for rather than
Misha 1:29:16
here's a strong one, right? Like, that's what it felt like, like men thinking, Oh, she's sassy and pushes back. That's what makes her like a feminist. But she'll still just be at the whim of whatever man shows up in her life. Yeah, whether it's her ex Hadees or Hercules.
Tyler 1:29:33
And it's probably telling that her whole vibe is based on like, screwball comedians of the 40s who were like, that's their whole thing is like, Oh, we got sassy day in here. Hey, see? Ya, that's sort of that sort of attitude. I mean, I totally agree with that. And I think maybe I'm just falling into the trap as a dude thinking that she's intriguing and like, interesting, maybe for those reasons, but she also like different but
Misha 1:29:58
it's like a fish To me a very male attitude about what makes a woman strong, because you can have a quiet, Meek woman who is stereotypically female in a lot of ways and is way stronger than she is and way more independent and self assured. And she doesn't have those qualities. Yeah, like she doesn't trust herself. She seems to rely on what other what the men tell her. You get sassy. And that's unlike witty and smart. And that doesn't necessarily make you strong in the way that I think more women need to be portrayed.
Tyler 1:30:47
I completely agree with all that. Yeah. The only thing I would
Misha 1:30:51
say they failed. They failed that character with the story. Yeah, I
Tyler 1:30:54
think I think the only maybe saving grace is like, I mean, it's not a saving grace. That's not the right way to put it. But like, little bit of silver lining is like, it's not she's not just, I mean, it's a lot of men telling her stuff. But she's like, if if they weren't there, like in the perfect world, she would have interesting things to do and say, and I don't mean that in like in a sassy, sarcastic way necessarily. But like she would if she weren't trapped by Hades, what would she be doing? That would be really interesting to see like, what right, but of course, the story doesn't go there because it's just
Misha 1:31:29
it doesn't allow any of that right. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I don't
Tyler 1:31:38
think this is a one however, because this is a bit of a curveball and maybe you'll shoot it down. Because I think the Muses should be talked about as well. The music is like being the narrator's is an interesting like, maybe just like a one point but like it I think it takes
Misha 1:31:55
a lead though. I think they're when you're a narrator. You're not part of they're not part of the story.
Tyler 1:32:02
Yeah, but I mean, I don't know I guess but I just like how they're like the I liked how they did that as a narration device. And its women a story, the storyteller? I don't know. I mean, I guess it doesn't really help because the whole thing super sexist in there. Yeah. I don't know. But I was trying to think of it in like a weird way because we like, the Muses like we gave lead points to like, matriarchal star,
Misha 1:32:31
not part of the story. And they're not even human. They're like drawings on a vase. You're right.
Tyler 1:32:37
They're muses. Yeah. So okay. Yeah. So I think in that case, it's like, well,
Misha 1:32:40
I want I would love to listen, I would be very happy if these aren't so fucking sexist. I'd love to give points, but I don't think that Hercules deserves it. No,
Tyler 1:32:54
I think you're right. I think you're right. One.
Misha 1:32:57
Okay. Okay. Well,
Tyler 1:32:58
bipoc representation slash portrayal. This isn't a one, but it's pretty low. I mean, that
Misha 1:33:06
is pretty low. The muses were a gospel choir that have black. What singers? Sorry, I was like, what do you call people partaking?
Tyler 1:33:21
The voice of voice music? musics. Yeah.
Misha 1:33:25
As you say, participants, these,
Tyler 1:33:28
these participants are really good. I like to do that. Because we've seen this before. People are like, Oh, that's not there were no, there were no black people in Poland or whatever. And they are like with frozen people got pissed off because it was like one person to Yes. So it's like, I liked how the they did this and like, and had like, solar and
Misha 1:33:49
Apollo. Yeah. Black character. I mean, I think and black actor. Yeah. David.
Tyler 1:33:58
Yeah. Keith David, who's absolutely a gem and totally, yeah, he's a jet. How dare they give him two lines in this movie and not use it? I
Misha 1:34:05
know. I was really I was actually bothered that he was in it so little, because he's really great. But anyway, with the music, so the Muses were part of the music. Right. And we've seen this before, where they're just kind of extra characters and not leads and I don't You're right. I don't think it should be. I don't think it should be a one but I think it should be a two.
Tyler 1:34:28
Yeah, I think that's perfectly fair. It's like, okay, and it could even be I mean, I'm not the right person to make this argument. Maybe you could even make the argument if you're being super like if you're being badly not pessimistic, but maybe more pragmatic, that this is tokenism to possibly. But
Misha 1:34:48
yeah, so that's what we talked about with power line, right. Sort of the exploitation of black music as as a problem rather than I mean, I, when you have a movie that's all white, essentially, except for one character with two lines, it's barely in it. And then it just kind of come across as exploitative rather than celebratory. I don't want to say that's what this is. Just that's a thing that happens in media. You
Tyler 1:35:23
couldn't I think, from my perspective, again, like white male with no intelligence, it seems celebratory to me like that. It's great that they chose to do this in the 90s at a time when high rest of the movie is sexist. And clearly, they were making bad choices. And then they made this choice. So I don't know you could make the argument that it's, I don't know.
Misha 1:35:41
I know. I never. I think too, it's like hard to decide, like, what if it is celebratory or exploited? Yeah, I think there was another movie. Am I getting this? Correct? Whether there's another movie where it's like, all white cast all white directors all white? Right, like everybody's white. And then there's a choir or a black singing group that they bring in? What is that? I know, this is a thing we've done. I
Tyler 1:36:10
mean, power line from Goofy Movie.
Misha 1:36:13
No, there's a group. Oh,
Tyler 1:36:16
I mean, Dumbo, but I don't think that's something you're thinking of.
Misha 1:36:19
Oh, it was. It was it might have been Dumbo. It was jump. It was Dumbo. I mean, it was Dumbo. Yeah, that's,
Tyler 1:36:26
I mean, that's different. That's different. That's different.
Misha 1:36:29
But it was Dumbo. It was Dubbo Yeah,
Tyler 1:36:33
yeah, it's not it's not that bad, obviously. But it's not Dumbo. But But I could totally Yeah, I mean, I'm not smart enough to make the distinction. But people who say like, there's no like these muses or why are you doing that in this movie? That's exploitative. That is totally valid argument, I think,
Misha 1:36:50
right? Yes, I Yeah. Okay, fun factor.
Tyler 1:36:56
Now, this is maybe where we're gonna have a disagreement, because in the end, like this movie is sexist. There's, there's a character who's basically a throbbing penis with tickers voice and Winnie the Pooh is voice. And everybody's sexist. Everybody's fucking horny as hell. And yet, there's like this. Maybe this is even maybe this is effervescence rather than fun, effective, but there's like a fun. And again, maybe this is just gonna
Misha 1:37:24
be a fun factor. I'm not giving you effervescence.
Tyler 1:37:27
Yeah, okay, so this, there's like this. Like, there's this, um, aside from its bad elements, this is like literally what effervescence is, in my mind. They're like, something greater than the sum of
Misha 1:37:39
its parts. Yeah.
Tyler 1:37:42
Sorry, I keep sorry. Shout out to Durkheim. Again, gotta give a shout out some a boy. But like, yeah, I don't know. Like this movie. Still. I watched it again last night and today, and I was like, obviously, there are huge issues with it. But I still like had a great time watching it. It's not a movie that I watched again, like, honestly, like I watch Alice in Wonderland. Again. I was like, boring. This movie is boring. But also I like it. But this movie, I watched him like this movie is bad, but fun. And so it's like the opposite of Alice in Wonderland to me.
Misha 1:38:12
We had this we have we're disagreeing on Alice. We can't.
Tyler 1:38:15
We had that conversation in the moment. Like I like it, but it was dull to rewatch it. But that might have just been my attitude that day. But this one was like, this is a bad movie, but I'm loving it. That's how I kind of went so
Misha 1:38:30
that my thing is the beginning was so slow. That it like it set my opinion on how fun it was. And I we already talked about I know what parts were fun. And I think there are some fun parts. I love painted panic. Or Hades is fun. The underworld is fun. The Witches are fun. I actually kind of like the part when the Titans are out like you know doing their tiny thing. Boom horses boo frozen. Oh, lava. Ooh, guys,
Tyler 1:39:00
like
Misha 1:39:02
smashing back. This
Tyler 1:39:03
is that way.
Misha 1:39:06
Yeah. Okay. Just like some fun parts. All of the parts with Hercules need to be taken out. Not fun. Not fun, not fun.
Tyler 1:39:17
I think the montage is where he's not talking or fun.
Misha 1:39:22
Where it's like they were just okay.
Tyler 1:39:23
It's like the the Muses because it's like the flashes of like the the fights and you get to see the cool monsters, you know?
Misha 1:39:29
Yeah. And I think but the pacing is a problem and maybe not have fun, right? It was hard to feel like the whole movie was fun. Because, like I said before, the parts that needed to be longer were super short and the parts that were super short, needed to be longer. And that affects one factor for sure.
Tyler 1:39:51
I mean, I would say like for me, it's somewhere around like a seven.
Misha 1:39:55
So
Tyler 1:39:58
so if it's like much lower For you, we can kind of meet the middle somewhere.
Misha 1:40:01
Maybe I was thinking five like halfway. Okay, I thought you were gonna say lower like, No, I was thinking of five. Like, the bad is really bad and the good is really good. And it's like half of it is enjoyable. Sure,
Tyler 1:40:17
I think fine. Yeah, I wasn't ever gonna say something like a 10 or something. I just think it was funner than average, but yeah, five is fine.
Misha 1:40:26
You do Yeah.
Tyler 1:40:30
doesn't sit right. I think this should be pretty penalized for like just constant, constant sort of toxic sex predator. It's not predators, toxic masculinity,
Misha 1:40:43
sex predators, toxic masculinity. I mean, but that's also Greek mythology like but it's not there's like struck like Oh, whatever. Yeah, this needs to be this is disgusting. It's really weird how like, I was not expecting this to be so over the top pervy at all, even though I knew was Greek mythology I was just like, because it's not even the Greek mythology parts that are pervy they like added it, they took out all of the actual Greek mythology. Just everywhere parts they took all that out, made Zeus some actual hero, which is bizarre. Fine, I get it it's a Disney movie but then added in what I guess these dumb Fox think is funny, which is just being sexual predators and sex pasts. Negative 10 Cut all their dicks off negative 10.
Tyler 1:41:46
Okay, you're not fighting with it? I can't. I can't. I can't defend. I mean, yeah, I still think the movie, but I can't defend the movie because I have so many problems with it, too. And it's like, also, but it's just so you know how there's like this. You know, it's a constant thing that happens in on the internet. It's like, oh, look at this, like, Secret Easter egg six thing in this movie. And it's like, yeah, a lot and had that like Aladdin. And like Lion King. This one. It's like, there's a man. There's a centaur half horse, half penis. And it's like, it's not. It's not like implicit at all. It's like his head is a winner. It's so weird that they got away with it. It's so it's so obvious. It's
Misha 1:42:31
just the but also just the language like the script is awful. With an a full of that and not like, like, sneakily putting it in there. Yeah.
Tyler 1:42:46
I wish. I wish this they had made a movie about meg. Because I I love Meg. I think I have a crush on Meg made me. But she this movie did her dirty. Disney just make a movie about meg. The Adventures of Meg. Honestly,
Misha 1:42:58
if it was just, this is what they should have done. Forget Hercules. It's Meg being wronged by her ex. Going through that, wanting to save him being duped by Hades and that hole and then her journey without finding a man at the end? Yeah. I mean, that would have been a much better movie. That'd be better. Yeah. Hades and Meg. Hades. Mag is the protagonist. Yeah, no sale. No. Honestly, if Phil wasn't in this, it would not be losing full 10 points. It wouldn't even be close. It was all PHIL You can't have a Seder. Anybody masturbating in bushes watching women. That's disgusting.
Tyler 1:43:46
You're right. I mean to be so to be super pedantic. There's no evidence of him masturbating but it's heavily it's sort of like God. The bush of the bushes are kind of moving this free but is jiggling around. Ah. Okay, all right. effervescence. Oh, he's
Misha 1:44:06
just gross throughout the whole thing. It's not just that he is. He's
Tyler 1:44:09
not says he's not. Yeah, he's
Misha 1:44:12
a bad person. Yeah, okay. They could have. I mean,
Tyler 1:44:17
it's kind of a boring way
Misha 1:44:20
to say like, dude, calm down. You're being a sex past. Yeah. Like you're being bad. You're really and that's where that's where yes. All men comes from. Yes, there are ones who are the perpetrators but where all the other ones saying stop being perpetrators. Hercules.
Tyler 1:44:41
Hercules. Okay.
Misha 1:44:45
Oh my God, those teats. Steve's so.
Tyler 1:44:49
Negative 10.
Misha 1:44:51
Yeah, for Oh my god. So whichever the animation adds to the doesn't sit right negative points do
Tyler 1:44:58
Okay, so Oh effervescent messes. I think it should get a little bit like maybe
Misha 1:45:03
I think it should get a little bit because the underworld I thought had some feelings. Yeah. Like I thought were really evocative, like, and I don't know, just really beautiful to look at.
Tyler 1:45:17
Yeah. It's got that little bit of that, like, magic and mystery element to Disney movies that like, yeah.
Misha 1:45:27
The coloring kind of romance scenes reminded me of Sleeping Beauty.
Tyler 1:45:31
Yeah. Yeah, indeed. The weird like, sort of ghostly green color. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. What do you think? Like a two or three?
Misha 1:45:42
I was thinking of three. Three of them. Oh, boy. Yeah, I really liked those parts. That's like all the edits. Like kind of that's a lot to give it but I really liked those parts. And the witches. I mean, if we could just give effervescence for those fiery witches I'd get and their whole thing. Yeah. 10.
Tyler 1:46:01
Okay, what's the total?
Misha 1:46:05
Okay. The total is 30 out of a possible 110, which is
Tyler 1:46:12
not good. That's not great. And that is much lower than I would have thought it would have gotten going into it, but then rewatching it. It's pretty clear why it gets that low. Yes.
Misha 1:46:22
So okay, Atlantis, which is sort of the same style. It has pacing problems. It has a bland protagonist that doesn't have the same level of perverted newness that this one has, but
Tyler 1:46:36
it had a lot of problems with like colonialism and yes, celebration of that. Yeah. But
Misha 1:46:41
like, just was like something else. Else. So it so it did a little bit worse than that.
Tyler 1:46:50
All right. Well, of next up is an movie that I've never seen, but I've heard through the grapevine that it is a wacky one.
Misha 1:47:00
Can I say something to you before you get on to that? And I'm sorry that I'm like, ranting so much. But it's just discussed. Brother Bear only did one point last fuck.
Tyler 1:47:12
Girls. Oh my god. Kiss ska. Boy. Yeah, that hurts. It hurts me, I guess. But that's why I said that to you. Hey, our heroes are monsters. So yeah. Our next step is a movie called Home on the Range. I know nothing about it, except it's supposedly very bonkers. So I'm kind of looking
Misha 1:47:42
for it. I don't know anything about it. Yeah.
Tyler 1:47:45
I there's like me there. Yeah,
Misha 1:47:47
it's about cows.
Tyler 1:47:49
I think it's about cows.
Misha 1:47:50
I think I remember seeing like a Longhorn steer on something. When we were looking up these movies at some point. I
Tyler 1:47:59
can't remember the types of cows but I remember there being cows. I think it is about cows on a farm doing weird cow stuff. But it's what does that mean? I don't know. Chewing cud, I don't know, crazy cow stuff. But it's supposedly very bonkers and doesn't make a lot of sense. So it might be fun. It might be a great might be a fun romp in time. Or it might be awful. Honestly, with our track record, it's probably horrible, but it'll be a delight talking about it with you. My good good friend.
Misha 1:48:34
Oh, Tyler, that was really sweet. It won't be a delay. This one where I'm grieving the whole fucking time. Oh my god. I never did my fun feather fact.
Tyler 1:48:46
Oh, yeah, the feather flag was the feather effect. Totally forgot. I'm
Misha 1:48:51
sorry. No, I did too. So when Hercules goes to Zeus statue for the first time, and Zeus is like, here's Pegasus. He goes. Oh, you know, here's something something about Pegasus with a brain of a bird. Implying that he's stupid. Fuck you. Zeus. I've got some news. Some birds like corvids you know the family? I do. Yeah. Okay, for people who don't know what corvids are because it's not like it doesn't whatever. Crows, ravens magpies. They are super intelligent. They're ranked as some of the most intelligent animals rivaling people. They pass the mirror test where they like understand that it's themselves in a reflection of a mirror. They know how to do complicated puzzles, and they can read signs and stuff like that and they're just really smart. And so for zoos to say that. Excuse me, your God. Shouldn't you know that some birds are just super smart. Anyway. Is that really a feather? Oh, I mean kind of tougher. COVID
Tyler 1:50:02
Alright, well until next time, Home on the Range. Thanks everyone for listening. If you want to get in touch with us you can email us [email protected] to tell us what you think and tell us like hey, I really love this perv movie or whatever. Let us know or you
Misha 1:50:18
can follow us on Twitter and Instagram @muchabupod and thanks everybody.
Tyler 1:50:22
We appreciate the support and see you next time. Bye bye